5 ms·

And the rest of the time it's illegible scrawl and has no place in basic education. Even [0], the US declaration of independence, is horrendous to read compare

And the rest of the time it's illegible scrawl and has no place in basic education. Even [0], the US declaration of independence, is horrendous to read compared to this 8 year old girl's handwriting. https://www.christies.com/lot/lot-declaration-of-independence-in-congress-july-6145873/ https://www.christies.com/lot/lot-declaration-of-independenc...?

retrac 5y ago
The chancery/round hand style used in the Declaration of Independence is not a style of cursive much used in the last ~150 years. So it's potentially quite difficult without some practice. A major part of why we teach (or taught) writing cursive is because it also helps teach you to read cursive. You may not need to write much, but until recently you would encounter written cursive all the time. In my experience it's still common enough. It'd be awkward to be unable to read the New Year's cards from my older relatives.
colechristensen 5y ago
It is, in essence, a different dialect of writing. It is not illegible, you just don’t know how to read it. Deposit yourself in Edinburgh, Appalachia, or rural Minnesota and you’ll have various levels of difficulty understanding how people speak, is their speech wrong or is your knowledge of their language lacking?
Someone 5y ago
Apart from the low resolution of that scan, I find that easy to read.
- TedDoesntTalk 5y ago
  The hi res version sibling posted at Wikipedia is very readable and very beautiful.
pcrh 5y ago
That is perfectly legible. Many modern fonts are less legible than that. I am curious about the opposition to cursive script that some people demonstrate, mostly in the US. In Europe cursive script is the norm; block letter writing by an adult is considered a mark of poor education.
- Broken_Hippo 5y ago
  "block letter writing by an adult is considered a mark of poor education" Are you sure about that? It isn't uncommon to require it on forms. Also, Europe is a big and varied place - perhaps it is just one part of Europe? Where in Europe were you referring to?
  - pcrh 5y ago
    In all European countries, adults are expected to be able to write cursive. Filling out forms in block letters is sometimes a requirement, for example to facilitate machine reading.
gattilorenz 5y ago
Not sure which cursive is taught in the US, but to me (having learned cursive writing in Southern Europe in the 90s) that looks surprisingly legible, if not for the quality of the picture in your link. Here's a high-res version: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/United_States_Declaration_of_Independence.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/United_S... Except for the "double s" that looks like an "f" (that ligature was common also in fonts for bookprinting at the times, so it's not hard to figure it out if you know that), the rest looks like a better version of the calligraphy I used to have when I was 9/10 years old (and that I wish I still had, now it's a much "simplified" - in shapes, not ease of reading - version of that). Update: also the single "s" is a bit peculiar, since it's completely different at the beginning VS at the end of a word
- dboreham 5y ago
  My experience with my kids going through school in the US is that cursive is not taught. When I expressed surprise at this to the elementary school principal he told me very few parents could write cursive either.
- booleandilemma 5y ago
  I thought you were going to be exaggerating but I agree, pretty legible, especially when zoomed in.
alar44 5y ago
I have no problem reading this. You just didn't learn how to read cursive I guess.

retrac 5y ago

The chancery/round hand style used in the Declaration of Independence is not a style of cursive much used in the last ~150 years. So it's potentially quite difficult without some practice. A major part of why we teach (or taught) writing cursive is because it also helps teach you to read cursive. You may not need to write much, but until recently you would encounter written cursive all the time. In my experience it's still common enough. It'd be awkward to be unable to read the New Year's cards from my older relatives.

colechristensen 5y ago

It is, in essence, a different dialect of writing. It is not illegible, you just don’t know how to read it. Deposit yourself in Edinburgh, Appalachia, or rural Minnesota and you’ll have various levels of difficulty understanding how people speak, is their speech wrong or is your knowledge of their language lacking?

Someone 5y ago

Apart from the low resolution of that scan, I find that easy to read.

TedDoesntTalk 5y ago
The hi res version sibling posted at Wikipedia is very readable and very beautiful.

pcrh 5y ago

That is perfectly legible. Many modern fonts are less legible than that. I am curious about the opposition to cursive script that some people demonstrate, mostly in the US. In Europe cursive script is the norm; block letter writing by an adult is considered a mark of poor education.

Broken_Hippo 5y ago
"block letter writing by an adult is considered a mark of poor education" Are you sure about that? It isn't uncommon to require it on forms. Also, Europe is a big and varied place - perhaps it is just one part of Europe? Where in Europe were you referring to?
- pcrh 5y ago
  In all European countries, adults are expected to be able to write cursive. Filling out forms in block letters is sometimes a requirement, for example to facilitate machine reading.

gattilorenz 5y ago

Not sure which cursive is taught in the US, but to me (having learned cursive writing in Southern Europe in the 90s) that looks surprisingly legible, if not for the quality of the picture in your link. Here's a high-res version: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/United_States_Declaration_of_Independence.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/United_S... Except for the "double s" that looks like an "f" (that ligature was common also in fonts for bookprinting at the times, so it's not hard to figure it out if you know that), the rest looks like a better version of the calligraphy I used to have when I was 9/10 years old (and that I wish I still had, now it's a much "simplified" - in shapes, not ease of reading - version of that). Update: also the single "s" is a bit peculiar, since it's completely different at the beginning VS at the end of a word

dboreham 5y ago
My experience with my kids going through school in the US is that cursive is not taught. When I expressed surprise at this to the elementary school principal he told me very few parents could write cursive either.
booleandilemma 5y ago
I thought you were going to be exaggerating but I agree, pretty legible, especially when zoomed in.

alar44 5y ago

I have no problem reading this. You just didn't learn how to read cursive I guess.