5 ms·
The study sounds like a crock of horseshit: "In this model, we assume that a large population of individuals comprises two distinct identity groups. These iden
by HideousKojima 5y ago
The study sounds like a crock of horseshit:
"In this model, we assume that a large population of individuals comprises two distinct identity groups. These identities are assumed fixed, and thus correspond to a fixed feature of identity such as race, religious heritage, or socioeconomic background. Although such identities are fixed in the model, the salience of the identity, and therefore its impact on behavior, varies."
The model assumes only two distinct and unchangeable identity groups, and assumes that these identity groups are solely based on a few specific unchangeable traits. And that's before you get into some of the wacky assumptions in their actual math model.
Also of note, they mention Charlottesville and the capitol riot as examples of political polarization, but make no mention of comparable events on the left like the BLM riots, the GOP baseball shooting, etc. Gives you a good idea of where the politics of the authors sit and suggests there may be motivated reasoning behind their arguments. "Solve political polarization by doing more of what the left has wanted to do for over a century!"
- praxulus 5y agoNot to defend their methodology, but your attempt to equate the GOP baseball shooting with an attempted coup says a lot more about your biases than the study authors'.
- chroem- 5y ago
- ModernMech 5y agoSome people were indeed just trespassing, and were charged with trespassing. Others were trespassing and also fighting with police, and they have been charged with more serious offenses. A third group went even further and was actually executing a plan to overthrow the government, and they have been charged with seditious conspiracy.
- dwater 5y agoOf the 700+ people charged for their participation in the January 6th Capitol riot, 11 have been charged with seditious conspiracy. 225 people were charged with assaulting, resisting, or impeding officers or employees. More than 75 of those were charged with using a deadly or dangerous weapon against police officers or causing serious bodily injury to an officer. 640 people were charged with entering a restricted federal building or its grounds. More than 75 were charged with entering a restricted area with a deadly weapon.
- chroem- 5y agoI don't believe it's fair to characterize the actions of a larger group based on those of a minority. We were repeatedly told that the summer 2020 protests were 93% peaceful, and that the fires, pipebombs, and shootings shouldn't distract from the larger message.
- rurp 5y agoIf Al Capone was a murderer why was he convicted of tax evasion?
- WalterBright 5y agoThere was the CHAZ (Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone) established in Seattle where they explicitly seceded from the United States. In doing so, they pushed out all the police and set fire to the police station while barricading the doors with the remaining police inside (fortunately, the police escaped). The CHAZ rioters also occupied and vandalized City Hall.
- stjohnswarts 5y agoWhich has absolutely nothing to do with a full on coupe attempting to end our democracy by capturing the VP and Congress. There has always been civil unrest in the USA since the beginning. However never has a President attempted to overthrow and subvert the will of the people in a Presidential election through a violent mob. The two things only share one thing in common "two groups of people doing violence"
- WalterBright 5y agoSeceding from the US is, literally, an insurrection.
- uniqueuid 5y agoI think you're coming at the paper from a very particular angle. This is fundamentally a mathematical simulation, so it's bound to be simplified. Assuming fixed identities is not completely unreasonable, given that affective and ideological polarization in the US has been increasing over decades. Yes some people switch, but not as many as you may think.
- chinchilla2020 5y agoComplex human thought processes cannot be modeled by a simplified mathematical model
- uniqueuid 5y agoRight. But simple human behavior can often be modeled by a simplified mathematical model :) My two favorite quotes on the subject are of course George Box: > all models are wrong, but some are useful And Avery Pennarun: > almost everything produced by ML could have been produced, more cheaply, using a very dumb heuristic you coded up by hand, because mostly the ML is trained by feeding it examples of what humans did while following a very dumb heuristic.
- ZeroGravitas 5y agoYou say "wanted to do for over a century" yet "the left" has been reducing inequality for several centuries now, abolishing monarchy, aristocrary, slavery and such, introducing voting and democracy and human rights and all that kind of thing. People seem to generally like it.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- HideousKojima 5y agoSome of the earliest efforts to abolish slavery came from Catholicism, especially Catholic Spain and Portugal. Not really sure how the left can take credit for that, but whatever floats your boat
- animal_spirits 5y agoNot going to argue with what you are saying but I want to point out that modern conservative Christianity is a very very different and derived religion than the religion of the Holy Roman Empire and the ancient Catholic Church.
- ashtonkem 5y agoThe catholic church’s involvement in the slave trade is much more complicated and morally ambiguous than you’re implying here. Popes have generally been consistent about the enslavement of Christians, but have waffled back and forth about the enslavement and transport of Africans and native Americans. Never mind all those serfs the church used to have…
- sib301 5y agoNo one is taking credit, and surely you’re smart enough to understand that two distinct groups can simultaneously work to achieve similar goals.
- antifa 5y agoI'm guessing you're implying all catholics are right wing?
- newbie789 5y ago
- WalterBright 5y agoThe left does indeed solve inequality, by making everyone poor. Such is the sorry history of communism.
- sd8f9iu 5y agoPeacefully protesting (and yes, the vast majority of BLM protests were peaceful [1]) the extrajudicial killing of black men is not remotely on the same level of extreme political activity as the outgoing president orchestrating a coup attempt to try and stay in power. There is no equivalency between far-right and far-left violence in the US. There is a much, much greater rise in far-right violence [2]. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/16/this-summers-black-lives-matter-protesters-were-overwhelming-peaceful-our-research-finds/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/16/this-summ... [2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/interactive/2021/domestic-terrorism-data/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/interactive/20...