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These keep popping all the time on HN recently and I don't like it. We had our fun taking jabs at people buying virtual receipts but nowadays it feels everyone

These keep popping all the time on HN recently and I don't like it. We had our fun taking jabs at people buying virtual receipts but nowadays it feels everyone wants to join the smug train. I'd appreciate some moderation on these articles (as in having much less of them around here). Yeah, we know: people basically give money for a small receipt that says "this thing is mine", ignoring the fact that the paper of that receipt might spontaneously disappear one day. We got it. So what? People literally bought paper strips absolving them from their sins some mere centuries ago. People do all sorts of stuff we don't immediately relate to. IMO the pertinent question around the NFT (and the general Web3 / dapps etc.) frenzy is just one: "If people want to buy stuff you don't like, well, let them, how does it harm you?" If that's not properly answered and if you can't prove to me that's going to hit me in my wallet later on (and I mean no later than the next 2-3 years) then we're just taking turns of making fun of people whose needs we don't understand. Example: I am not bashing anyone who is buying a Bentley. To me that's unnecessary and expensive but to them it's likely super important and that's the salient point here: you don't know these other people's needs and you don't understand WHAT exactly they are buying with their money. I would think they are buying an ugly overpriced car but they might be buying it e.g. so they are allowed in new circles which need demonstration of status? I am posting this comment as a guy who single-handedly coded the entire backend of a Web3 app some mere 3 months ago and has seen the absurdity of people flocking to buy NFTs due to a good slogan on a website (hosted on Web 1.0 / 2.0 no less). But in the end I get it; a lot of NFTs are presented in the form of campaigns to support or champion a cause, and others are marketed at being unique and deserving of status, etc. Good marketing, appealing to certain human traits, and people open up their wallets. Why not? Not for me personally but I am not judging. In the end I am the guy who bought Airpods Max ($540) just so he can use them 2-3 times a week to listen to the occasional song or a podcast, so who am I to judge? We all do things that are weird to others. Live and let live. As for technical merit, the article is correct but IMO that discussion has been beaten to death already.

magicjosh 5y ago
Well said. Is there some area of the internet / web / tech that's full of curiosity and exploration today? My answer 10 years ago was MAKE magazine, but that era is over now. Maybe people are just smug about everything these days.
- pdimitar 5y ago
  I really wish to know the same but I have a feeling we won't find that place on HN. Hope I am wrong.
- acdha 5y ago
  There’s a lot of that going on still - the maker / 3d printing folks are still beavering away, there’s plenty of open source creativity, etc. There are three big changes I think make it harder to see: 1. Google nuked Reader at the same time Facebook declared war on the open web. I follow this kind of stuff on blogs but a lot of people definitely shifted to social media. 2. The field is maturing in some ways, and a lot of open source energy moved into companies. That means that small projects are competing with Facebook for contributors and attention, and that there is less low-hanging fruit. A cool wearable hack now has to do something an Apple Watch, etc. doesn’t. 3. A lot of younger people are worried about things like climate change. Clean tech seems to have a lot of the people who a generation ago might have been doing web things.
- dannyocean 5y ago
acdha 5y ago
We live in the world proof of waste is polluting and most of us know people who are getting the sales pitch to buy in with money they can’t afford to lose. Those of us who work in tech are seeing the market distorted by companies which have no plausible path to viability (you’re still competing with them for hires and investors) and consultants pitching your senior management on huge gambles on unsuitable technology.
- pdimitar 5y ago
  Fair points but that's hardly the buyers fault, no? The Bitcoin and Ethereum networks have been humming along for a long long time before the NFT wave hit. RE: competing for hires and investors, hmmm. I do agree but I question how long will they last so it's IMO a self-correcting problem. I might be wrong though; I've witnessed companies with literally no product to sell coast on investor goodwill and general hype (to my amazement and dismay) for years.
  - acdha 5y ago
    I think it's a bit hard to separate the two, however: cryptocurrency had been developing a bad reputation and NFTs feel like they were ramped up as a marketing push to finally give people a reason to buy in. The large holders who want to recoup the money they put in have a lot of influence and media presence so any time you see someone like @cdixon talking up the benefits of web3 you have to remember that his company has a couple of billion dollars on the line and adjust your credulity to compensate. I do think it'll eventually correct but never underestimate how long the market can remain irrational, or the damage which can be caused if they start getting connected in to other industries. There's a good argument that, for example, the real estate bubble was in part pumped up by the big sovereign wealth & pension funds who lost money on poor dotcom choices and were seeking new high-return investments. I really don't want to see that happen again if someone convinces them that they should go long on NFTs.
dhosek 5y ago
The problem is that all the blockchain stuff takes HUGE amounts of electricity and this is not without cost to society. The better analogy than indulgences would be rhino horn.
- pdimitar 5y ago
  Yep, true, but again, can we expect the common citizens to grab their guns (which most citizens of the world don't have btw; USA is the outlier in this regard) and go hunt and shut down the cryptocurrency mining operations?

magicjosh 5y ago

Well said. Is there some area of the internet / web / tech that's full of curiosity and exploration today? My answer 10 years ago was MAKE magazine, but that era is over now. Maybe people are just smug about everything these days.

pdimitar 5y ago
I really wish to know the same but I have a feeling we won't find that place on HN. Hope I am wrong.
acdha 5y ago
There’s a lot of that going on still - the maker / 3d printing folks are still beavering away, there’s plenty of open source creativity, etc. There are three big changes I think make it harder to see: 1. Google nuked Reader at the same time Facebook declared war on the open web. I follow this kind of stuff on blogs but a lot of people definitely shifted to social media. 2. The field is maturing in some ways, and a lot of open source energy moved into companies. That means that small projects are competing with Facebook for contributors and attention, and that there is less low-hanging fruit. A cool wearable hack now has to do something an Apple Watch, etc. doesn’t. 3. A lot of younger people are worried about things like climate change. Clean tech seems to have a lot of the people who a generation ago might have been doing web things.
dannyocean 5y ago

acdha 5y ago

We live in the world proof of waste is polluting and most of us know people who are getting the sales pitch to buy in with money they can’t afford to lose. Those of us who work in tech are seeing the market distorted by companies which have no plausible path to viability (you’re still competing with them for hires and investors) and consultants pitching your senior management on huge gambles on unsuitable technology.

pdimitar 5y ago
Fair points but that's hardly the buyers fault, no? The Bitcoin and Ethereum networks have been humming along for a long long time before the NFT wave hit. RE: competing for hires and investors, hmmm. I do agree but I question how long will they last so it's IMO a self-correcting problem. I might be wrong though; I've witnessed companies with literally no product to sell coast on investor goodwill and general hype (to my amazement and dismay) for years.
- acdha 5y ago
  I think it's a bit hard to separate the two, however: cryptocurrency had been developing a bad reputation and NFTs feel like they were ramped up as a marketing push to finally give people a reason to buy in. The large holders who want to recoup the money they put in have a lot of influence and media presence so any time you see someone like @cdixon talking up the benefits of web3 you have to remember that his company has a couple of billion dollars on the line and adjust your credulity to compensate. I do think it'll eventually correct but never underestimate how long the market can remain irrational, or the damage which can be caused if they start getting connected in to other industries. There's a good argument that, for example, the real estate bubble was in part pumped up by the big sovereign wealth & pension funds who lost money on poor dotcom choices and were seeking new high-return investments. I really don't want to see that happen again if someone convinces them that they should go long on NFTs.

dhosek 5y ago

The problem is that all the blockchain stuff takes HUGE amounts of electricity and this is not without cost to society. The better analogy than indulgences would be rhino horn.

pdimitar 5y ago
Yep, true, but again, can we expect the common citizens to grab their guns (which most citizens of the world don't have btw; USA is the outlier in this regard) and go hunt and shut down the cryptocurrency mining operations?