5 ms·

If everyone were vegan, only a quarter of current farmland would be needed

helsinkiandrew 5y ago
https://web.archive.org/web/20220128210852/https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2022/01/28/if-everyone-were-vegan-only-a-quarter-of-current-farmland-would-be-needed https://web.archive.org/web/20220128210852/https://www.econo...
WaxedChewbacca 5y ago
scantis 5y ago
This calculation is fatally flawed. Meat processors are extremely efficient in producing calories from unusable material in any environment. For example a reindeer eats basically moss, wild mushrooms and gras and can grow to 60 to 80 kg in a year. They can occupy unfarmable land. Goats can be easily raised in mild desert, where there is no way to efficiently farm anything else. There other even more efficient protein processors, like fish, who don't even require farmable land. There are various types of wild chicken that can be held a forrests. They eat various insects and are much more tasty because of it. Most high end pigs are exclusively fed by acorn and the like to aquire an astonishing well defined taste. You can not eat acorns directly, and even if you process them into oblivion, they can not compete with bacon. We waste 70% of our produce, but it can be easily put into pigs as meat processors. We can also extract the fat first and put it through insects first as a protein processor. This can then be fed to meat processors and produce something delicious. Ever heard of free range gras fed cows in the Alps? The land is basically unfarmable for anything else. These cows are super delicious. The vegan diet requires a lot of different materials shipped from all over the world to meet a sufficient nutritional baseline. Due to climate shifts and wate consumptions, Farmland for such specialized nutritions of high value becomes more and more rare. Sure we can easily reach our calorie intake by producing a ton of highly processed starch, with a minimum of farmable land, but we would start to severely reverse Flynn's effect because of it.
- throwawaynay 5y ago
  Except most livestock eat soy and other cereals, that are specially grown for them. Forests are still being razed to grow food for livestock. Most of the food grown on earth is used to feed livestock. There is absolutely not a single valid justification for eating meat, you're fooling yourself.
  - scantis 5y ago
    There are tons of justifications nutritional value availability it being delicious tradition and heritage sustainability and so many more Even you whole food vegan types have a final form as a hunter. It is the logical conclusion if you care about the environment and animals, want low CO2 emissions and stay away from high intensity farming.
    - throwawaynay 5y ago
      yeah hunting seems like a genius way of feeding 7 billion people taste, tradition and heritage are not justifications. You can justify cannibalism using the same arguments.
      - scantis 5y ago
        We easily feed them and move a year supply of food around the world just mess with the prices. Also we throw away about 70% of human food. Canibalism can cause severe deseases, if the protein isn't prepared correctly, but for craps it seems the way to go to find stability with any habitat. It is my personal opinion to strive for a future with more variety in food and more opportunities. Instead of being vegan and eat a block of starch each day.
- nabla9 5y ago
  Everything you say is probably true but you don't consider how your proposed solutions scale. They don't. The amount of meat produced by the methods you suggest is several magnitudes too small. If you remove large-scale farming where pigs, chickens, and cows are fed grains and soy, global meat consumption would be very small. Free-range does not produce enough meat to produce even a fraction of current consumption. China imports huge amounts of soy from the US because there is not enough calories to feed their pigs. You are proposing boutique solutions that would mean meat consumption would be just a fraction of what it is now. Count calories per hectare and you realize that your solutions don't work on scale. cattle 300 million pigs 1.5 billion chicken 70 billion

https://web.archive.org/web/20220128210852/https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2022/01/28/if-everyone-were-vegan-only-a-quarter-of-current-farmland-would-be-needed https://web.archive.org/web/20220128210852/https://www.econo...

WaxedChewbacca 5y ago

scantis 5y ago

This calculation is fatally flawed. Meat processors are extremely efficient in producing calories from unusable material in any environment. For example a reindeer eats basically moss, wild mushrooms and gras and can grow to 60 to 80 kg in a year. They can occupy unfarmable land. Goats can be easily raised in mild desert, where there is no way to efficiently farm anything else. There other even more efficient protein processors, like fish, who don't even require farmable land. There are various types of wild chicken that can be held a forrests. They eat various insects and are much more tasty because of it. Most high end pigs are exclusively fed by acorn and the like to aquire an astonishing well defined taste. You can not eat acorns directly, and even if you process them into oblivion, they can not compete with bacon. We waste 70% of our produce, but it can be easily put into pigs as meat processors. We can also extract the fat first and put it through insects first as a protein processor. This can then be fed to meat processors and produce something delicious. Ever heard of free range gras fed cows in the Alps? The land is basically unfarmable for anything else. These cows are super delicious. The vegan diet requires a lot of different materials shipped from all over the world to meet a sufficient nutritional baseline. Due to climate shifts and wate consumptions, Farmland for such specialized nutritions of high value becomes more and more rare. Sure we can easily reach our calorie intake by producing a ton of highly processed starch, with a minimum of farmable land, but we would start to severely reverse Flynn's effect because of it.

throwawaynay 5y ago
Except most livestock eat soy and other cereals, that are specially grown for them. Forests are still being razed to grow food for livestock. Most of the food grown on earth is used to feed livestock. There is absolutely not a single valid justification for eating meat, you're fooling yourself.
- scantis 5y ago
  There are tons of justifications nutritional value availability it being delicious tradition and heritage sustainability and so many more Even you whole food vegan types have a final form as a hunter. It is the logical conclusion if you care about the environment and animals, want low CO2 emissions and stay away from high intensity farming.
  - throwawaynay 5y ago
    yeah hunting seems like a genius way of feeding 7 billion people taste, tradition and heritage are not justifications. You can justify cannibalism using the same arguments.
    - scantis 5y ago
      We easily feed them and move a year supply of food around the world just mess with the prices. Also we throw away about 70% of human food. Canibalism can cause severe deseases, if the protein isn't prepared correctly, but for craps it seems the way to go to find stability with any habitat. It is my personal opinion to strive for a future with more variety in food and more opportunities. Instead of being vegan and eat a block of starch each day.
nabla9 5y ago
Everything you say is probably true but you don't consider how your proposed solutions scale. They don't. The amount of meat produced by the methods you suggest is several magnitudes too small. If you remove large-scale farming where pigs, chickens, and cows are fed grains and soy, global meat consumption would be very small. Free-range does not produce enough meat to produce even a fraction of current consumption. China imports huge amounts of soy from the US because there is not enough calories to feed their pigs. You are proposing boutique solutions that would mean meat consumption would be just a fraction of what it is now. Count calories per hectare and you realize that your solutions don't work on scale. cattle 300 million pigs 1.5 billion chicken 70 billion