7 ms·

The OP doesn't say complain to crypto users. It says that we need to inform the general public so that they are immunised against the draw of these schemes.

RedBeetDeadpool 5y ago
Immunized against what exactly though? Is there even one thing about owning crypto that people need protection from? Its an asset class like any other and if you want an NFT buy an NFT. If you want to buy a pokemon card, buy a pokemon card. If you'd rather spend it on a car, buy a car. You're gonna get fraudsters with any asset. People will sell you houses that have bug problems hidden from you. Car dealerships will fleece you and have been since the first car salesman existed. Scammers have been counterfeiting dollars since they have been printed. McDonalds has been selling tasty unhealthy foods since they became a franchise. Mail order brides have been scamming the purchasers of their wife and money. Are we supposed to now shout out about every scam in existence? What makes crypto so unique among scammable things (literally everything) that it needs an army of anti-cryptocurrency advocates running down the streets with pitchforks and cardboard signs?
- adam_arthur 5y ago
  Crypto so far is largely a vast space with little intrinsic value. The "technological veil" over it seems to confer more legitimacy to crypto projects than is really warranted. E.g. people buying land in the "metaverse", which is really just some hastily implemented crap game/mmo. Less technical people aren't going to understand that the perfectly legitimate technology is a ruse covering up illegitimate investment ideas. But personally, Im not too worried. Fiscally irresponsible people will always find a way to throw away their money one way or another. It will seem quite obvious in hindsight, however.
  - RedBeetDeadpool 5y ago
    > Crypto so far is largely a vast space with little intrinsic value. So was pokemon. By my definition that's a crap game even without crypto. But millions of people have fun playing it and its a big part of their lives, so who am I to judge?
    - adam_arthur 5y ago
      The intrinsic value of pokemon is the enjoyment you get out of playing. Thus people are willing to pay money to play it. "Investments" in crypto tend to have value because you can sell it to somebody else for more, not because the intrinsic value increases over time. E.g. like a cashflowing business increasing their cashflow, or raising rents on a rental property. This is self referential, people aren't paying more because it provides higher intrinsic value, but due to speculation.
      - RedBeetDeadpool 5y ago
        People buy expensive art because its popular. They also do nothing but stare at it every once in a while. Is that intrinsic value? Because if that is, then so is crypto.
        adam_arthur 5y ago
        People buy expensive art because it's an exclusive item, and they value the bragging rights it confers to them (generally). It's different from NFTs, which are just pointers to an item rather than the actual item itself. But I agree with you that crypto bears some similarity to art/gold/collectibles. However crypto can be spawned out of thin air and these other things can't. Why would the world settle on using a Blockchain where a few whales hold huge percentages of the coins? People will just invent a new one and standardize on that. If decentralized apps become the new norm. This would devalue existing blockchains and their tokens greatly. The only ones motivated to stay on a Blockchain with enormous inequality are the few early adopters. The public would create a standard and adopt that in longer run if Blockchain backed decentralized apps are truly the future.
        2pEXgD0fZ5cF 5y ago
        > People buy expensive art because its popular. Let's say I can magically create thousands of copies of the mona lisa, perfect 100% copies of the original at the Louvre with no method known to man now or in the future to distinguish them. Now imagine that I shuffle those 100% perfect copies with the original and distribute them all across the world in galleries, auction houses, museums, some universities etc. (basically any facilities with a chance to have access to people with the ability to notice that this might be the original painting). Assuming that the experts trying to find the original now that it is gone from the Louvre are honest and don't lie: Do you believe the Mona Lisa would still retain its value assessment?
- systemvoltage 5y ago
  You don’t understand the real reason behind all this. The true naked reason is that people want more regulation and government interference. Step 1 is to paint a dire picture of the need for regulation.
  - cuteboy19 5y ago
    And to what end do people want more regulation? If anything regulation would legitimise crypto so either it should be banned or it should not be touched
mattwilsonn888 5y ago
I don't think you realize how much the laughably obtuse skeptic and the crypto die-hards have in common. Both agree that 98% of the space is a scam (though not in market cap terms), its just some people actually look in to find the pockets of progress and value, while others ignore it all and stay poor and resentful. I hate using the term "stay poor," but when I continually see these forever skeptics less versed in blockchain space and current progress than those who simply read and make a moderate effort its hard to conclude that these skeptics are drawing conclusions from their deep understanding of what is going on; it must be something more shallow, like missing out.
- cuteboy19 5y ago
  I wouldn't be so sure about market caps. Tether (#3) and USDC (#5) have a combined market cap of 120 billion. Both are backed by nothing more than IoUs Regarding 'stay poor', the vast majority of crypto 'investors' bought in during 2021, meaning that most of them have lost money. Which is of course expected for any net negative 'investment'. It is not cryptoskeptics who are staying poor, I'm afraid
- timeon 5y ago
  You missed proof of waste in your conclusion.

RedBeetDeadpool 5y ago

Immunized against what exactly though? Is there even one thing about owning crypto that people need protection from? Its an asset class like any other and if you want an NFT buy an NFT. If you want to buy a pokemon card, buy a pokemon card. If you'd rather spend it on a car, buy a car. You're gonna get fraudsters with any asset. People will sell you houses that have bug problems hidden from you. Car dealerships will fleece you and have been since the first car salesman existed. Scammers have been counterfeiting dollars since they have been printed. McDonalds has been selling tasty unhealthy foods since they became a franchise. Mail order brides have been scamming the purchasers of their wife and money. Are we supposed to now shout out about every scam in existence? What makes crypto so unique among scammable things (literally everything) that it needs an army of anti-cryptocurrency advocates running down the streets with pitchforks and cardboard signs?

adam_arthur 5y ago
Crypto so far is largely a vast space with little intrinsic value. The "technological veil" over it seems to confer more legitimacy to crypto projects than is really warranted. E.g. people buying land in the "metaverse", which is really just some hastily implemented crap game/mmo. Less technical people aren't going to understand that the perfectly legitimate technology is a ruse covering up illegitimate investment ideas. But personally, Im not too worried. Fiscally irresponsible people will always find a way to throw away their money one way or another. It will seem quite obvious in hindsight, however.
- RedBeetDeadpool 5y ago
  > Crypto so far is largely a vast space with little intrinsic value. So was pokemon. By my definition that's a crap game even without crypto. But millions of people have fun playing it and its a big part of their lives, so who am I to judge?
  - adam_arthur 5y ago
    The intrinsic value of pokemon is the enjoyment you get out of playing. Thus people are willing to pay money to play it. "Investments" in crypto tend to have value because you can sell it to somebody else for more, not because the intrinsic value increases over time. E.g. like a cashflowing business increasing their cashflow, or raising rents on a rental property. This is self referential, people aren't paying more because it provides higher intrinsic value, but due to speculation.
    - RedBeetDeadpool 5y ago
      People buy expensive art because its popular. They also do nothing but stare at it every once in a while. Is that intrinsic value? Because if that is, then so is crypto.
      - adam_arthur 5y ago
        People buy expensive art because it's an exclusive item, and they value the bragging rights it confers to them (generally). It's different from NFTs, which are just pointers to an item rather than the actual item itself. But I agree with you that crypto bears some similarity to art/gold/collectibles. However crypto can be spawned out of thin air and these other things can't. Why would the world settle on using a Blockchain where a few whales hold huge percentages of the coins? People will just invent a new one and standardize on that. If decentralized apps become the new norm. This would devalue existing blockchains and their tokens greatly. The only ones motivated to stay on a Blockchain with enormous inequality are the few early adopters. The public would create a standard and adopt that in longer run if Blockchain backed decentralized apps are truly the future.
      - 2pEXgD0fZ5cF 5y ago
        > People buy expensive art because its popular. Let's say I can magically create thousands of copies of the mona lisa, perfect 100% copies of the original at the Louvre with no method known to man now or in the future to distinguish them. Now imagine that I shuffle those 100% perfect copies with the original and distribute them all across the world in galleries, auction houses, museums, some universities etc. (basically any facilities with a chance to have access to people with the ability to notice that this might be the original painting). Assuming that the experts trying to find the original now that it is gone from the Louvre are honest and don't lie: Do you believe the Mona Lisa would still retain its value assessment?
systemvoltage 5y ago
You don’t understand the real reason behind all this. The true naked reason is that people want more regulation and government interference. Step 1 is to paint a dire picture of the need for regulation.
- cuteboy19 5y ago
  And to what end do people want more regulation? If anything regulation would legitimise crypto so either it should be banned or it should not be touched

mattwilsonn888 5y ago

I don't think you realize how much the laughably obtuse skeptic and the crypto die-hards have in common. Both agree that 98% of the space is a scam (though not in market cap terms), its just some people actually look in to find the pockets of progress and value, while others ignore it all and stay poor and resentful. I hate using the term "stay poor," but when I continually see these forever skeptics less versed in blockchain space and current progress than those who simply read and make a moderate effort its hard to conclude that these skeptics are drawing conclusions from their deep understanding of what is going on; it must be something more shallow, like missing out.

cuteboy19 5y ago
I wouldn't be so sure about market caps. Tether (#3) and USDC (#5) have a combined market cap of 120 billion. Both are backed by nothing more than IoUs Regarding 'stay poor', the vast majority of crypto 'investors' bought in during 2021, meaning that most of them have lost money. Which is of course expected for any net negative 'investment'. It is not cryptoskeptics who are staying poor, I'm afraid
timeon 5y ago
You missed proof of waste in your conclusion.