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This is exactly my point: the government advanced exactly this theory and the crucial point is they lost in court. They were forced to weaken the laws as a resu

This is exactly my point: the government advanced exactly this theory and the crucial point is they lost in court. They were forced to weaken the laws as a result. The new laws remain constitutionally untested and the government seems very eager to keep them that way.

kragen 5y ago
Agreed. But public opinion has shifted; people in the US think "free speech" is a "right-wing issue" now, and as you can see every time China is mentioned on HN there are ten thousand xenophobic comments by assholes from the US who don't even know the difference between the Cultural Revolution and the Great Leap Forward. In theory public opinion shouldn't affect the outcome of a court case unless it results in statutory or constitutional changes, but of course it does. Given the current trend toward authoritarianism, the longer the government can delay the court battle, the better their chances.
- matthewdgreen 5y ago
  With due respect, the right wing is perfectly happy to use the power of government to suppress speech they don’t like. See eg the new bills banning discussion of sexual identity in Florida schools. I usually regret responding to OT partisan comments, but statements of belief like “<my preferred political party> is the party of free speech” is exactly how you end up voting in a government that brutally suppresses free speech.
  - kragen 5y ago
    I didn't mean the right wing was actually in favor of free speech, and I should have been clearer about that. The right wing has never been in favor of free speech, nearly by definition. The consequence is that the US political scene is dominated by two illiberal parties, much like, for example, Egypt after Mubarak's flight, or the late Weimar Republic. I'm surprised that you'd think right-wing US parties were my preferred political party; maybe you've forgotten who I am because I stopped using Twitter. Still, I'd think even my comments in this thread would provide abundant evidence of my commitments to liberalism and distaste for authoritarianism.
    - iszomer 5y ago
      I don't think it is strictly a partisan issue but the potential precedence where a re-normalization event may occur. What struck me curious was a random quote quote from somewhere that reads: "conservatism is progressivism with speed limits". I mean, where have we seen instances where such precedences have been set in the grassroot moments all the way to our highest courts? Crypto export control. DeCSS. SDMI. Effects from twitter bots from the early years and now?

kragen 5y ago

Agreed. But public opinion has shifted; people in the US think "free speech" is a "right-wing issue" now, and as you can see every time China is mentioned on HN there are ten thousand xenophobic comments by assholes from the US who don't even know the difference between the Cultural Revolution and the Great Leap Forward. In theory public opinion shouldn't affect the outcome of a court case unless it results in statutory or constitutional changes, but of course it does. Given the current trend toward authoritarianism, the longer the government can delay the court battle, the better their chances.

matthewdgreen 5y ago
With due respect, the right wing is perfectly happy to use the power of government to suppress speech they don’t like. See eg the new bills banning discussion of sexual identity in Florida schools. I usually regret responding to OT partisan comments, but statements of belief like “<my preferred political party> is the party of free speech” is exactly how you end up voting in a government that brutally suppresses free speech.
- kragen 5y ago
  I didn't mean the right wing was actually in favor of free speech, and I should have been clearer about that. The right wing has never been in favor of free speech, nearly by definition. The consequence is that the US political scene is dominated by two illiberal parties, much like, for example, Egypt after Mubarak's flight, or the late Weimar Republic. I'm surprised that you'd think right-wing US parties were my preferred political party; maybe you've forgotten who I am because I stopped using Twitter. Still, I'd think even my comments in this thread would provide abundant evidence of my commitments to liberalism and distaste for authoritarianism.
  - iszomer 5y ago
    I don't think it is strictly a partisan issue but the potential precedence where a re-normalization event may occur. What struck me curious was a random quote quote from somewhere that reads: "conservatism is progressivism with speed limits". I mean, where have we seen instances where such precedences have been set in the grassroot moments all the way to our highest courts? Crypto export control. DeCSS. SDMI. Effects from twitter bots from the early years and now?