4 ms·

It is endemic. Its everywhere. Its mutating. Humanity has never stopped the spread of similar coronaviruses and even if we could the death rate/risk is not bad

It is endemic. Its everywhere. Its mutating. Humanity has never stopped the spread of similar coronaviruses and even if we could the death rate/risk is not bad enough to justify the cost (this isnt smallpox/polio) We have vaccines. They don’t stop you from getting it or transmitting it. They do lower probability of the vaccinated person getting severe/fatal covid. Clearly a personal health decision that should not be mandated (although I would encourage it) Mask are of marginal help. Mandates dont change actual behavior. Life goes on. (Me: triple vaxxed and have had Covid 2x)

uoaei 5y ago
Not endemic. Will you accept a formal assessment of endemicity from a PI at the Vaccine and Infectious Disease Organization? See as of two weeks ago: https://twitter.com/angie_rasmussen/status/1480899954163863553 https://twitter.com/angie_rasmussen/status/14808999541638635... Not interested in playing word games. Words mean things. Get over it. > [Vaccines] don’t stop you from getting [COVID] or transmitting it. This is a harmful framing. What ultimately matters is Rt < 1. Do vaccines get us closer to that? Yes. Does not breathing on each other help with that? Yes. Does avoiding indoor gatherings prevent us from breathing on each other? Yes. Do masks and adequate ventilation help us reduce the amount of exposure when contact is unavoidable? Yes. Ergo each of these factors contributes to reducing the reproduction rate of the virus when applied. Wow, the power of simple logical deductions. Try it sometime. Deliberately obfuscating truths by painting a false dichotomy is misinformation. Life doesn't go on for the multitudes of preventable deaths that have occurred and will occur because people like you continue to push false narratives.
- mmmpop 5y ago
  > Words mean things. Get over it. Oh man, lemme tell you about the last time I used that one in an unrelated but equally controversial topic... I was browbeaten out of the room. "Words mean things (when that is convenient for my argument!)"
  - the_only_law 5y ago
    > "Words mean things (when that is convenient for my argument!)" This sort of idea sums up modern politics, or the entire history of it for all I know.
  - uoaei 5y ago
    Anecdata? Supporting your pre-supposed conclusions?? Color me convinced!
- pcmoney 5y ago
  Ok so now what? We lock down society for a relatively benign virus whose more extreme outcomes are mostly ameliorated by vaccines and therapies? I am all for you encouraging people to vaccinate but if they don’t then that is their choice. (Me: triple vaxxed and still got covid 2x) There a millions of preventable deaths of many kinds every year. Why is this cause special (now today, not with our previous situation in 2020) Also: An endemic disease is a disease that is always present in a particular population/region. Ex. Flu, malaria, HIV, syphilis, and… COVID (When they do declare this an endemic next month do I get a prize?) Additionally we have never eliminated a coronavirus before. This isn’t smallpox/polio.
  - uoaei 5y ago
    > Ok so now what? We lock down society for a relatively benign virus Awwww, you made that little straw man just for me?! You're too kind... (Your first mistake is acting like there's only two sides to this, and because I advocate taking more care, then you think I unflinchingly parrot the CDC and other hysterical bullshit. Not so :)!) > still got covid 2x Were there things you could have done differently not to catch it? Probably! In the spirit of "let everyone do what they want" then it follows directly that you agentively chose to put yourself in a position to catch and spread COVID. This is the main issue with libertarian-style arguments -- you accept full culpability if everything else is framed through the lens of agency. > https://clinicalinfo.hiv.gov/en/glossary/endemic https://clinicalinfo.hiv.gov/en/glossary/endemic Endemicity as you correctly point out is with relation to a particular population or region. That means more care needs to be put in to assigning particular viruses that status. HIV is not endemic to the US (it is in West Africa), neither is malaria (ditto but wider range) nor apparently COVID (of course, not yet, but the outcome is inevitable only if you act like it is). > Why is this cause special Because there's a lot of built-up infrastructure and society-wide attention on the problem, given the last couple years, which gives us a lot more leverage for having a strong effect on the outcome compared to something like a particular flu or rhinovirus. It's special because we're talking about this disease right now and not a different one. Seems obvious to me, but if ignoring reality makes you more comfortable then by all means. Just don't make your mistakes other peoples' problems.
    - 5y ago
watersb 5y ago
> Life goes on. (Me: triple vaxxed and have had Covid 2x) I can't agree with a lot of what you are posting here, but this totally got my attention. You've had all your shots, and had covid twice so far? Can you say more about that? How bad was it for you? My daughter had a mild case, weeks after 2nd vaccination, when she returned to college last Fall. She was ok. I think that if everyone could do what you've done, we'd be able to figure out if we're at a modern influenza situation already. But the crush in the hospitals is real. We're not there yet.
- pcmoney 5y ago
  Sure, first round was 2020 and pre-vaccines but positive PCR (had recently had surgery and needed negative PCRs to go the physical therapy) It was just a sore throat and some heavy fatigues. Symptoms for about 3 days but no cough, loss of taste, or fever. Second round was omicron in December shortly after being boosted. Symptoms of cough, fatigue, and shortness of breath. Much more sever symptoms the second time but only for about 3 days. Also had contracted bronchitis right before so that probably contributed. Note: with the cold that lead to bronchitis I was nervous it was Covid so rapid tested 5x over 3 weeks. All came back negative, including 2 that came back right before and after a positive PCR. Anecdotally I have strong doubts on rapid test efficacy with Omicron (friends had similar experiences)
  - watersb 5y ago
    What an experience... Thanks. Glad it was relatively mild for you. Some of my folks live on a Native American reservation. They lost lots of people, at first. It burned real hard. The more I learn, the more confused I get. Immunology is complicated. Public policy plus community building plus immunology... makes my career in software development look like a kid playing in a sandbox.

uoaei 5y ago

Not endemic. Will you accept a formal assessment of endemicity from a PI at the Vaccine and Infectious Disease Organization? See as of two weeks ago: https://twitter.com/angie_rasmussen/status/1480899954163863553 https://twitter.com/angie_rasmussen/status/14808999541638635... Not interested in playing word games. Words mean things. Get over it. > [Vaccines] don’t stop you from getting [COVID] or transmitting it. This is a harmful framing. What ultimately matters is Rt < 1. Do vaccines get us closer to that? Yes. Does not breathing on each other help with that? Yes. Does avoiding indoor gatherings prevent us from breathing on each other? Yes. Do masks and adequate ventilation help us reduce the amount of exposure when contact is unavoidable? Yes. Ergo each of these factors contributes to reducing the reproduction rate of the virus when applied. Wow, the power of simple logical deductions. Try it sometime. Deliberately obfuscating truths by painting a false dichotomy is misinformation. Life doesn't go on for the multitudes of preventable deaths that have occurred and will occur because people like you continue to push false narratives.

mmmpop 5y ago
> Words mean things. Get over it. Oh man, lemme tell you about the last time I used that one in an unrelated but equally controversial topic... I was browbeaten out of the room. "Words mean things (when that is convenient for my argument!)"
- the_only_law 5y ago
  > "Words mean things (when that is convenient for my argument!)" This sort of idea sums up modern politics, or the entire history of it for all I know.
- uoaei 5y ago
  Anecdata? Supporting your pre-supposed conclusions?? Color me convinced!
pcmoney 5y ago
Ok so now what? We lock down society for a relatively benign virus whose more extreme outcomes are mostly ameliorated by vaccines and therapies? I am all for you encouraging people to vaccinate but if they don’t then that is their choice. (Me: triple vaxxed and still got covid 2x) There a millions of preventable deaths of many kinds every year. Why is this cause special (now today, not with our previous situation in 2020) Also: An endemic disease is a disease that is always present in a particular population/region. Ex. Flu, malaria, HIV, syphilis, and… COVID (When they do declare this an endemic next month do I get a prize?) Additionally we have never eliminated a coronavirus before. This isn’t smallpox/polio.
- uoaei 5y ago
  > Ok so now what? We lock down society for a relatively benign virus Awwww, you made that little straw man just for me?! You're too kind... (Your first mistake is acting like there's only two sides to this, and because I advocate taking more care, then you think I unflinchingly parrot the CDC and other hysterical bullshit. Not so :)!) > still got covid 2x Were there things you could have done differently not to catch it? Probably! In the spirit of "let everyone do what they want" then it follows directly that you agentively chose to put yourself in a position to catch and spread COVID. This is the main issue with libertarian-style arguments -- you accept full culpability if everything else is framed through the lens of agency. > https://clinicalinfo.hiv.gov/en/glossary/endemic https://clinicalinfo.hiv.gov/en/glossary/endemic Endemicity as you correctly point out is with relation to a particular population or region. That means more care needs to be put in to assigning particular viruses that status. HIV is not endemic to the US (it is in West Africa), neither is malaria (ditto but wider range) nor apparently COVID (of course, not yet, but the outcome is inevitable only if you act like it is). > Why is this cause special Because there's a lot of built-up infrastructure and society-wide attention on the problem, given the last couple years, which gives us a lot more leverage for having a strong effect on the outcome compared to something like a particular flu or rhinovirus. It's special because we're talking about this disease right now and not a different one. Seems obvious to me, but if ignoring reality makes you more comfortable then by all means. Just don't make your mistakes other peoples' problems.
  - 5y ago

watersb 5y ago

> Life goes on. (Me: triple vaxxed and have had Covid 2x) I can't agree with a lot of what you are posting here, but this totally got my attention. You've had all your shots, and had covid twice so far? Can you say more about that? How bad was it for you? My daughter had a mild case, weeks after 2nd vaccination, when she returned to college last Fall. She was ok. I think that if everyone could do what you've done, we'd be able to figure out if we're at a modern influenza situation already. But the crush in the hospitals is real. We're not there yet.

pcmoney 5y ago
Sure, first round was 2020 and pre-vaccines but positive PCR (had recently had surgery and needed negative PCRs to go the physical therapy) It was just a sore throat and some heavy fatigues. Symptoms for about 3 days but no cough, loss of taste, or fever. Second round was omicron in December shortly after being boosted. Symptoms of cough, fatigue, and shortness of breath. Much more sever symptoms the second time but only for about 3 days. Also had contracted bronchitis right before so that probably contributed. Note: with the cold that lead to bronchitis I was nervous it was Covid so rapid tested 5x over 3 weeks. All came back negative, including 2 that came back right before and after a positive PCR. Anecdotally I have strong doubts on rapid test efficacy with Omicron (friends had similar experiences)
- watersb 5y ago
  What an experience... Thanks. Glad it was relatively mild for you. Some of my folks live on a Native American reservation. They lost lots of people, at first. It burned real hard. The more I learn, the more confused I get. Immunology is complicated. Public policy plus community building plus immunology... makes my career in software development look like a kid playing in a sandbox.