6 ms·

My family ate beef/chicken leftovers (from butchers and such) when they moved to my city. They never stole. Stealing is never OK.

loceng 5y ago
You can't imagine any circumstance where it's okay?
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
monsieurbanana 5y ago
We should all be clamoring that stealing is never OK. But NOT with examples of poor people scraping for food. Stealing is a deep problem in our society, and poor people have nothing to do with that.
- BizarroLand 5y ago
  I would argue that the real issue is being in a position where you would need to steal food during a time of relative prosperity. I know no one should be forced to be a charity but there should be a line somewhere that as a society we do not cross.
frgtpsswrdlame 5y ago
Stealing is okay in all sorts of situations. Many things in life are more important than the rule of property.
- mgh2 5y ago
  Scale up this mentality, you have South America
  - frgtpsswrdlame 5y ago
    But I didn't say all stealing was okay, I said some stealing definitely is okay. I still think that's true. Some things in life are more important than property.
    - nate_meurer 5y ago
      Out of curiosity, what are some things that are not more important than property rights in your opinion?
      - QuercusMax 5y ago
        Intellectual property rights?
        nate_meurer 5y ago
        Good one, I agree.
    - kortilla 5y ago
      Like what? Having a nice watch? Some Nike shoes?
    - nybble41 5y ago
      > Some things in life are more important than property. If the property isn't important, why are you stealing it? Personally I don't really care whether you think it's moral or not to steal, as long as you acknowledge that a victim of theft has an equally moral right to "steal" back what was taken, and to use a similar justification to steal a proportional (additional) amount from perpetrator. "Turnabout is fair play" and all that.
      - elcomet 5y ago
        > If the property isn't important, why are you stealing it? Because I'm starving so I'm stealing a sandwich ? Because I don't have the money to buy something that would save my life (Medical treatment for instance) ?
Grimburger 5y ago
Stealing food to survive and not die of hunger while there's abundant waste all around is not "ok"? I'd imagine that strong allcaps viewpoint would change in certain circumstances.
- mgh2 5y ago
  Dumpster diving or getting "waste" to survive is not stealing, is being resourceful. It is like "hacking" vs. "cheating" the system, subtle difference. Nobody "owned" it since it was thrown away - unless you think racoons have rights...
  - 8note 5y ago
    It's still owned by the person while it's in their trash can, til the trash is collected. It's stealing; just not stealing the owner is likely to care about. Sometimes they do, and put locks in their dumpsters though
    - mgh2 5y ago
      Maybe they lock dumpsters because of liability https://www.avvo.com/legal-answers/if-i-give-a-homeless-person-free-food-left-over--m-4560026.html https://www.avvo.com/legal-answers/if-i-give-a-homeless-pers...
      - nate_meurer 5y ago
        Around here, dumpsters are often locked to prevent dumping. The apartments across the street are plagued by dumpers who come at all hours and fill the dumpsters, mostly with construction debris it seems. Residents end up just piling shit on the ground around them.
    - tick_tock_tick 5y ago
      No most countries consider trash abandoned property and free for anyone to grab.
- MomoXenosaga 5y ago
munk-a 5y ago
Lets say that the manager's incontrovertible proof proves to be incorrect and neither party has committed a moral fault. The system the manager has leveraged for enforcement is protected from any sort of rebuke (I assume you can't sue someone for failing to make CoL adjustments in Argentina) so freezing someone's salary essentially just comes down to a form of wage theft. Bear in mind that in America, I'm not certain about Argentina, wage theft is the most expensive crime (summed across all instances) worse than burglary, stealing office supplies, or even robbing your employer. I agree that stealing is generally not OK - but maybe lets start by addressing the most prevalent form of stealing - by the powerful against the powerless.
- maxilevi 5y ago
  With that logic the one doing the wage theft is the goverment for causing the inflation in the first place and not allowing other currencies to be used.
- nate_meurer 5y ago
  No, if CoL adjustments were not built into an employment agreement, then it's not wage theft in any sense.
exolymph 5y ago
Stealing is sometimes okay, but usually the kinds of people who try to justify it do so because they infantilize criminals, which is maddening.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
dukeofdoom 5y ago
Being tolerant is not always a virtue. I visited countries before with very agreeable people living absolute disparity. Had they been less agreeable, they may have overthrow their inept and corrupt governments decades ago. For their own good. People in Cuba still have to line up for hours to get pitiful food rations from the government stores. Blows my mind that nonsense is still going on, decades after near everywhere else Communism has been abolished.
oh_sigh 5y ago
You wouldn't steal a sandwich if you were literally starving to death on the streets?
- danlugo92 5y ago
  My family nor me ever did when so.
l30n4da5 5y ago
Never advocated that stealing was okay. I'm just making an observation...

loceng 5y ago

You can't imagine any circumstance where it's okay?

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

monsieurbanana 5y ago

We should all be clamoring that stealing is never OK. But NOT with examples of poor people scraping for food. Stealing is a deep problem in our society, and poor people have nothing to do with that.

BizarroLand 5y ago
I would argue that the real issue is being in a position where you would need to steal food during a time of relative prosperity. I know no one should be forced to be a charity but there should be a line somewhere that as a society we do not cross.

frgtpsswrdlame 5y ago

Stealing is okay in all sorts of situations. Many things in life are more important than the rule of property.

mgh2 5y ago
Scale up this mentality, you have South America
- frgtpsswrdlame 5y ago
  But I didn't say all stealing was okay, I said some stealing definitely is okay. I still think that's true. Some things in life are more important than property.
  - nate_meurer 5y ago
    Out of curiosity, what are some things that are not more important than property rights in your opinion?
    - QuercusMax 5y ago
      Intellectual property rights?
      - nate_meurer 5y ago
        Good one, I agree.
  - kortilla 5y ago
    Like what? Having a nice watch? Some Nike shoes?
  - nybble41 5y ago
    > Some things in life are more important than property. If the property isn't important, why are you stealing it? Personally I don't really care whether you think it's moral or not to steal, as long as you acknowledge that a victim of theft has an equally moral right to "steal" back what was taken, and to use a similar justification to steal a proportional (additional) amount from perpetrator. "Turnabout is fair play" and all that.
    - elcomet 5y ago
      > If the property isn't important, why are you stealing it? Because I'm starving so I'm stealing a sandwich ? Because I don't have the money to buy something that would save my life (Medical treatment for instance) ?

Grimburger 5y ago

Stealing food to survive and not die of hunger while there's abundant waste all around is not "ok"? I'd imagine that strong allcaps viewpoint would change in certain circumstances.

mgh2 5y ago
Dumpster diving or getting "waste" to survive is not stealing, is being resourceful. It is like "hacking" vs. "cheating" the system, subtle difference. Nobody "owned" it since it was thrown away - unless you think racoons have rights...
- 8note 5y ago
  It's still owned by the person while it's in their trash can, til the trash is collected. It's stealing; just not stealing the owner is likely to care about. Sometimes they do, and put locks in their dumpsters though
  - mgh2 5y ago
    Maybe they lock dumpsters because of liability https://www.avvo.com/legal-answers/if-i-give-a-homeless-person-free-food-left-over--m-4560026.html https://www.avvo.com/legal-answers/if-i-give-a-homeless-pers...
    - nate_meurer 5y ago
      Around here, dumpsters are often locked to prevent dumping. The apartments across the street are plagued by dumpers who come at all hours and fill the dumpsters, mostly with construction debris it seems. Residents end up just piling shit on the ground around them.
  - tick_tock_tick 5y ago
    No most countries consider trash abandoned property and free for anyone to grab.
MomoXenosaga 5y ago

munk-a 5y ago

Lets say that the manager's incontrovertible proof proves to be incorrect and neither party has committed a moral fault. The system the manager has leveraged for enforcement is protected from any sort of rebuke (I assume you can't sue someone for failing to make CoL adjustments in Argentina) so freezing someone's salary essentially just comes down to a form of wage theft. Bear in mind that in America, I'm not certain about Argentina, wage theft is the most expensive crime (summed across all instances) worse than burglary, stealing office supplies, or even robbing your employer. I agree that stealing is generally not OK - but maybe lets start by addressing the most prevalent form of stealing - by the powerful against the powerless.

maxilevi 5y ago
With that logic the one doing the wage theft is the goverment for causing the inflation in the first place and not allowing other currencies to be used.
nate_meurer 5y ago
No, if CoL adjustments were not built into an employment agreement, then it's not wage theft in any sense.

exolymph 5y ago

Stealing is sometimes okay, but usually the kinds of people who try to justify it do so because they infantilize criminals, which is maddening.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

dukeofdoom 5y ago

Being tolerant is not always a virtue. I visited countries before with very agreeable people living absolute disparity. Had they been less agreeable, they may have overthrow their inept and corrupt governments decades ago. For their own good. People in Cuba still have to line up for hours to get pitiful food rations from the government stores. Blows my mind that nonsense is still going on, decades after near everywhere else Communism has been abolished.

oh_sigh 5y ago

You wouldn't steal a sandwich if you were literally starving to death on the streets?

danlugo92 5y ago
My family nor me ever did when so.

l30n4da5 5y ago

Never advocated that stealing was okay. I'm just making an observation...