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This made me think on this recent event: “ Stowaway found in South Africa plane wheel at Amsterdam airport”[1] Amazing to survive without oxygen and probably

This made me think on this recent event: “ Stowaway found in South Africa plane wheel at Amsterdam airport”[1] Amazing to survive without oxygen and probably not decent clothes at that altitude for that long. [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60104010 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60104010

sandworm101 5y ago
The lack of oxygen isn't really a problem. At 30-40k feet you will likely pass out, but a few hours will not kill a healthy person. The cold certainly might, but there is enough air for basic breathing needs. Those drop-down oxygen masks on aircraft are really not necessary. If you remain calm you will probably be fine. If you panic then you will pass out and wake up once the plane descends to denser air. I'd be far more afraid of being crushed or snapped in half by the hydraulic gear. There is thinking that those oxygen masks should be removed from planes. They have likely never saved a life, but they have caused at least one crash after the oxygen generators ignited.
- melenaboija 5y ago
  Totally agree, being smashed by the wheel sounds dangerous. The lack of oxygen for a long period though can have severe consequences or even kill someone. That is at least in the mountain where you need more oxygen as you are moving but staying few hours in any condition at 30-40k feet still does seem a problem to me. https://climbtallpeaks.com/how-high-can-you-climb-before-you-need-oxygen/ https://climbtallpeaks.com/how-high-can-you-climb-before-you...
  - sithadmin 5y ago
    30-40k ft is absolutely a problem. Even if you remain conscious, you're completely unable to think coherently and generally have no idea what you're doing. Stay there long enough and you will unquestionably suffer brain damage and probably death as well. SmarterEveryDay did a good video about hypoxia training that demonstrates the very rapid onset and severe effects of hypoxia at cruising altitudes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw
    - ngokevin 5y ago
      There's a reason why it's called the Death Zone (26k feet). And people that go up there acclimate for days or weeks, often with oxygen tanks anyways. And this plane story is likely going from sea level instantly to 40K.
- tehjoker 5y ago
  They would keep people awake and alert even if they don't pass out. That's pretty useful in an emergency.
- rezonant 5y ago
  You will pass out in 15 seconds no matter how calm you are. Then, after 4 minutes without oxygen you will begin to suffer brain damage. The oxygen generator the mask is connected to generally supplies about 15-20m of oxygen which is more than enough as it typically only takes 2-4 minutes for the emergency descent the pilot will do after loss of cabin pressure, this is of course, assuming the pilot is still conscious himself. There are numerous accidents where the pilots themselves delay putting on their oxygen masks with disastrous consequences, because your critical thinking and reasoning skills hit the floor within seconds. The main point of the oxygen masks though is primarily to keep all passengers alert and ready as it is essential that at all times an evacuation can be performed in under 90 seconds. When the passengers are not able to reason correctly due to hypoxia, that's effectively impossible. This is what could kill you and your fellow passengers if you fail to put on your oxygen mask in a pressurization failure incident. Which incident are you referring to with the oxygen generators igniting? Not this one I hope? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ValuJet_Airlines_Flight_592 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ValuJet_Airlines_Flight_592 > However, the NTSB quickly determined that just before takeoff, 144[15] expired chemical oxygen generators, each slightly larger than the size of a tennis ball can, had been placed in the cargo compartment in five boxes marked COMAT (company material) by ValuJet's maintenance contractor, SabreTech, in violation of Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) regulations forbidding the transport of hazardous materials in passenger aircraft cargo holds. Because that's not exactly the fault of the ones that were installed on the plane itself.
  - sandworm101 5y ago
    >> You will pass out in 15 seconds no matter how calm you are. Well, I certainly didn't. In training (military) I did a pressure chamber day with 33,000ft breathing (lots of fun, do it if you ever get the chance). They took us to 12,000 in a big chamber and then fed us a reduced oxygen via masks to simulate 33,000ft. After about a minute I certainly felt effects, but I was very much awake long long after 15 seconds. I was playing solitaire on an iPad thing. After everyone noticed their personal symptoms they switched us over to pure O2. Some experienced tunnel vision and such. All I ever felt was as slight headache and that I was doing worse at the ipad game. I was awake enough to remember the Sargent who walked up and down the chamber looking us in the eye to see if we were awake. He was scary.
- ArnoVW 5y ago
  Loss of pressure at 30k is deadly. In recent history a mechanic forgot to reset 'oxygen' to 'auto' after some debugging session. The two pilots missed it on their checklist. While they were climnbing they gradually lost consciousness. One of the non flight crew ended up being the only conscious person on board. When his air ran out, he lost consciousness. The flight ended when all kerosine was used, by flying into a hillside. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helios_Airways_Flight_522 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helios_Airways_Flight_522
hutzlibu 5y ago
Or the other recent events with planes leaving afghanistan with people who tried the same on the wheels, but as far as I know no one succeded alive.

sandworm101 5y ago

The lack of oxygen isn't really a problem. At 30-40k feet you will likely pass out, but a few hours will not kill a healthy person. The cold certainly might, but there is enough air for basic breathing needs. Those drop-down oxygen masks on aircraft are really not necessary. If you remain calm you will probably be fine. If you panic then you will pass out and wake up once the plane descends to denser air. I'd be far more afraid of being crushed or snapped in half by the hydraulic gear. There is thinking that those oxygen masks should be removed from planes. They have likely never saved a life, but they have caused at least one crash after the oxygen generators ignited.

melenaboija 5y ago
Totally agree, being smashed by the wheel sounds dangerous. The lack of oxygen for a long period though can have severe consequences or even kill someone. That is at least in the mountain where you need more oxygen as you are moving but staying few hours in any condition at 30-40k feet still does seem a problem to me. https://climbtallpeaks.com/how-high-can-you-climb-before-you-need-oxygen/ https://climbtallpeaks.com/how-high-can-you-climb-before-you...
- sithadmin 5y ago
  30-40k ft is absolutely a problem. Even if you remain conscious, you're completely unable to think coherently and generally have no idea what you're doing. Stay there long enough and you will unquestionably suffer brain damage and probably death as well. SmarterEveryDay did a good video about hypoxia training that demonstrates the very rapid onset and severe effects of hypoxia at cruising altitudes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw
  - ngokevin 5y ago
    There's a reason why it's called the Death Zone (26k feet). And people that go up there acclimate for days or weeks, often with oxygen tanks anyways. And this plane story is likely going from sea level instantly to 40K.
tehjoker 5y ago
They would keep people awake and alert even if they don't pass out. That's pretty useful in an emergency.
rezonant 5y ago
You will pass out in 15 seconds no matter how calm you are. Then, after 4 minutes without oxygen you will begin to suffer brain damage. The oxygen generator the mask is connected to generally supplies about 15-20m of oxygen which is more than enough as it typically only takes 2-4 minutes for the emergency descent the pilot will do after loss of cabin pressure, this is of course, assuming the pilot is still conscious himself. There are numerous accidents where the pilots themselves delay putting on their oxygen masks with disastrous consequences, because your critical thinking and reasoning skills hit the floor within seconds. The main point of the oxygen masks though is primarily to keep all passengers alert and ready as it is essential that at all times an evacuation can be performed in under 90 seconds. When the passengers are not able to reason correctly due to hypoxia, that's effectively impossible. This is what could kill you and your fellow passengers if you fail to put on your oxygen mask in a pressurization failure incident. Which incident are you referring to with the oxygen generators igniting? Not this one I hope? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ValuJet_Airlines_Flight_592 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ValuJet_Airlines_Flight_592 > However, the NTSB quickly determined that just before takeoff, 144[15] expired chemical oxygen generators, each slightly larger than the size of a tennis ball can, had been placed in the cargo compartment in five boxes marked COMAT (company material) by ValuJet's maintenance contractor, SabreTech, in violation of Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) regulations forbidding the transport of hazardous materials in passenger aircraft cargo holds. Because that's not exactly the fault of the ones that were installed on the plane itself.
- sandworm101 5y ago
  >> You will pass out in 15 seconds no matter how calm you are. Well, I certainly didn't. In training (military) I did a pressure chamber day with 33,000ft breathing (lots of fun, do it if you ever get the chance). They took us to 12,000 in a big chamber and then fed us a reduced oxygen via masks to simulate 33,000ft. After about a minute I certainly felt effects, but I was very much awake long long after 15 seconds. I was playing solitaire on an iPad thing. After everyone noticed their personal symptoms they switched us over to pure O2. Some experienced tunnel vision and such. All I ever felt was as slight headache and that I was doing worse at the ipad game. I was awake enough to remember the Sargent who walked up and down the chamber looking us in the eye to see if we were awake. He was scary.
ArnoVW 5y ago
Loss of pressure at 30k is deadly. In recent history a mechanic forgot to reset 'oxygen' to 'auto' after some debugging session. The two pilots missed it on their checklist. While they were climnbing they gradually lost consciousness. One of the non flight crew ended up being the only conscious person on board. When his air ran out, he lost consciousness. The flight ended when all kerosine was used, by flying into a hillside. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helios_Airways_Flight_522 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helios_Airways_Flight_522

hutzlibu 5y ago

Or the other recent events with planes leaving afghanistan with people who tried the same on the wheels, but as far as I know no one succeded alive.