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> When was the last time a driver update broke game on a console? Ever had to install support software to make a game work well with a particular controller? Is

> When was the last time a driver update broke game on a console? Ever had to install support software to make a game work well with a particular controller? Issues with overlays and system feature integration? Unexpected performance loss due to weird configuration? Mysterious DRM malfunction issues? Windows Update gone wrong? I agree (I don't get why people downvotes). My argument is that a quality PC does not have that problems. The fact that you can get a very cheap PC creates many of this situations. But I get into "No true Scotsman" territory with that logic. And that is why I agree with your arguments.

nemothekid 5y ago
>My argument is that a quality PC does not have that problems. Part of nvidia's drivers often contain workarounds and hacks specific to games. Sometimes they have gone wrong and bricked a game until the developer or nvidia can fix it. Buying a "quality" PC doesn't alleviate you from having to use nvidia drivers.
marcan_42 5y ago
But those things I mentioned happen regardless of the hardware build quality. Hardware quality will avoid hardware issues, things like overheating or stability problems. The things I mentioned are software integration problems that are a natural consequence of the PC ecosystem being much more heterogeneous. It doesn't matter how good your hardware is. There's just no way around the fact that when your ecosystem gives people much more choice and flexibility, it's going to be jankier than one which doesn't. It's just math. As you add dimensions to the problem space you reduce the fraction of the problem space you can test to ensure the user experience is good, and you rely on users to figure out how to reach a good point in that space, since you can't do it for them. If your dimensions are at least separable you might have a better chance (linear scaling instead of exponential), but modern systems are too complex to keep one issue from influencing others. It's a massive engineering problem.
ux-app 5y ago
The cost or "quality" of the PC is not a factor. Just the simple fact that you have to manually install graphics drivers is a basic issue that you don't have to deal with on console. Just visit any of the PCgaming subreddits and you'll find plenty of examples to do with troubleshooting graphics issues, with people suggesting using Graphics Driver Uninstaller to try and completely remove conflicting driver versions etc.etc. I remember when there were annoying stutters after the initial BF1 launch and one of the workarounds was to use task manager to change the CPU priority for the task. Here's an example thread for ModernWarfare https://www.reddit.com/r/modernwarfare/comments/j26zli/stutteringcpu_priority_issues_pc/ https://www.reddit.com/r/modernwarfare/comments/j26zli/stutt... Literally none of those issues affect console gaming. It's sit down and start gaming without any hassles within 15 sec of turning the machine on. I've been a PC gamer for 30 years and it's a pain in the ass compared to console. With the new generation of consoles targeting 60fps, my final annoyance with console gaming has disappeared.

nemothekid 5y ago

>My argument is that a quality PC does not have that problems. Part of nvidia's drivers often contain workarounds and hacks specific to games. Sometimes they have gone wrong and bricked a game until the developer or nvidia can fix it. Buying a "quality" PC doesn't alleviate you from having to use nvidia drivers.

marcan_42 5y ago

But those things I mentioned happen regardless of the hardware build quality. Hardware quality will avoid hardware issues, things like overheating or stability problems. The things I mentioned are software integration problems that are a natural consequence of the PC ecosystem being much more heterogeneous. It doesn't matter how good your hardware is. There's just no way around the fact that when your ecosystem gives people much more choice and flexibility, it's going to be jankier than one which doesn't. It's just math. As you add dimensions to the problem space you reduce the fraction of the problem space you can test to ensure the user experience is good, and you rely on users to figure out how to reach a good point in that space, since you can't do it for them. If your dimensions are at least separable you might have a better chance (linear scaling instead of exponential), but modern systems are too complex to keep one issue from influencing others. It's a massive engineering problem.

ux-app 5y ago

The cost or "quality" of the PC is not a factor. Just the simple fact that you have to manually install graphics drivers is a basic issue that you don't have to deal with on console. Just visit any of the PCgaming subreddits and you'll find plenty of examples to do with troubleshooting graphics issues, with people suggesting using Graphics Driver Uninstaller to try and completely remove conflicting driver versions etc.etc. I remember when there were annoying stutters after the initial BF1 launch and one of the workarounds was to use task manager to change the CPU priority for the task. Here's an example thread for ModernWarfare https://www.reddit.com/r/modernwarfare/comments/j26zli/stutteringcpu_priority_issues_pc/ https://www.reddit.com/r/modernwarfare/comments/j26zli/stutt... Literally none of those issues affect console gaming. It's sit down and start gaming without any hassles within 15 sec of turning the machine on. I've been a PC gamer for 30 years and it's a pain in the ass compared to console. With the new generation of consoles targeting 60fps, my final annoyance with console gaming has disappeared.