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>divest Instagram and WhatsApp and stop buying competitors I actually thought that was the point of antitrust action. The thing that FB monopolizes is the soci

>divest Instagram and WhatsApp and stop buying competitors I actually thought that was the point of antitrust action. The thing that FB monopolizes is the social graph, in any incarnation. (It is a remarkable innovation, to realize that this is a defensible moat; I personally would not have guessed that. But yes, it's a politically meaningful position and so will inevitably be either attacked or (worse) coopted by government)

AnthonyMouse 5y ago
Not everything is a monolith. There exist people who want to actually do something about their market power, as there exist people who want to actually do something about Apple's. The people doing it to pressure them will use the same arguments, because the arguments are good. But if Facebook is sufficiently compliant, the lack of meaningful consequences will increase in probability. None of this is perfectly immutable. If the public wanted Facebook broken up really bad, it might happen. But there's a strong chance it goes the same way as Microsoft, i.e. people want something done, so there is a case filed against them, people assume something is being done, and then years later they settle the case without addressing anything and the company is now ten times bigger than they were when they were already too big. It's not that public pressure doesn't matter, it's that there isn't currently enough of it to make change. Especially when the targets control the discourse. Who wants to make odds that social media algorithms are deprioritizing criticism or critics of social media market power?
- manquer 5y ago
  Is there any data which shows Facebook is not compliant? If anything Apple is definitely more non compliant and has publicly opposed FBI requests for data even in cases with poor optics and pushed publicly more for e2e encryption and user privacy over law enforcement needs.
  - AnthonyMouse 5y ago
    > Is there any data which shows Facebook is not compliant? Maybe they are. The case is the Sword of Damocles. If they're compliant, it hangs over them to keep them that way, to be settled for a nominal fee some years from now. You'll know non-compliance if the sword comes down and chops off their arms and legs. > If anything Apple is definitely more non compliant and has publicly opposed FBI requests for data even in cases with poor optics and pushed publicly more for e2e encryption and user privacy over law enforcement needs. That's a different fight. Unelected officials trying to score PR points in favor of increased spying powers, as opposed to elected officials who have different means and goals.
    - manquer 5y ago
      It is anti-trust suit to divest Instagram/WhatsApp by the DoJ, other actions against them are also by agencies/ officials who are not elected either . Same DoJ does not pursue any monopoly action against Apple, even when customers its hurts consumers pockets directly like with the App Store 30% cut. I do not see any difference between types of agencies and actions for either company. Apple makes distinct public steps towards making life harder for the government and do not invite retribution/reaction from the government. Facebook does not publicly do much to oppose government policy and they need a sword hanging over them ? To me this does not hold water.

AnthonyMouse 5y ago

Not everything is a monolith. There exist people who want to actually do something about their market power, as there exist people who want to actually do something about Apple's. The people doing it to pressure them will use the same arguments, because the arguments are good. But if Facebook is sufficiently compliant, the lack of meaningful consequences will increase in probability. None of this is perfectly immutable. If the public wanted Facebook broken up really bad, it might happen. But there's a strong chance it goes the same way as Microsoft, i.e. people want something done, so there is a case filed against them, people assume something is being done, and then years later they settle the case without addressing anything and the company is now ten times bigger than they were when they were already too big. It's not that public pressure doesn't matter, it's that there isn't currently enough of it to make change. Especially when the targets control the discourse. Who wants to make odds that social media algorithms are deprioritizing criticism or critics of social media market power?

manquer 5y ago
Is there any data which shows Facebook is not compliant? If anything Apple is definitely more non compliant and has publicly opposed FBI requests for data even in cases with poor optics and pushed publicly more for e2e encryption and user privacy over law enforcement needs.
- AnthonyMouse 5y ago
  > Is there any data which shows Facebook is not compliant? Maybe they are. The case is the Sword of Damocles. If they're compliant, it hangs over them to keep them that way, to be settled for a nominal fee some years from now. You'll know non-compliance if the sword comes down and chops off their arms and legs. > If anything Apple is definitely more non compliant and has publicly opposed FBI requests for data even in cases with poor optics and pushed publicly more for e2e encryption and user privacy over law enforcement needs. That's a different fight. Unelected officials trying to score PR points in favor of increased spying powers, as opposed to elected officials who have different means and goals.
  - manquer 5y ago
    It is anti-trust suit to divest Instagram/WhatsApp by the DoJ, other actions against them are also by agencies/ officials who are not elected either . Same DoJ does not pursue any monopoly action against Apple, even when customers its hurts consumers pockets directly like with the App Store 30% cut. I do not see any difference between types of agencies and actions for either company. Apple makes distinct public steps towards making life harder for the government and do not invite retribution/reaction from the government. Facebook does not publicly do much to oppose government policy and they need a sword hanging over them ? To me this does not hold water.