4 ms·

But it looks like the vaccines don't stop the spread of covid: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC8481107/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/

But it looks like the vaccines don't stop the spread of covid: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC8481107/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC8481107/

soperj 5y ago
They stop the hospitals from filling up though.
- Jimmc414 5y ago
  Tobacco kills 8 million of its users, annually. Why is their presence in ICU beds not a topic of concern?
  - mgh2 5y ago
    I will think because it is not contagious and does not affect the global economy as such
  - amanaplanacanal 5y ago
    Probably because that number is fairly stable over time. Beds exist for that load. A new load is a problem, because staffed hospital beds take time to create. It takes years to make a new nurse or doctor, for instance.
    - rajin444 5y ago
      Why can’t we just group antivaxxers with smokers then? We’ve ignored the obesity problem for a long time and are taking 0 steps to correct after we’ve seen our health systems buckle in no small part due to it. If you’re in favor of mandates but not forced weight loss you’re just playing politics. Yes, one is easier than the other, but the magnitude of good done by reducing obesity dwarfs the good done by vaccines. If the US had ignored Covid and focused solely on obesity we would likely have been better off in terms of all cause mortality.
      - amanaplanacanal 5y ago
        Nobody knows what is causing the obesity epidemic, unfortunately. There are a lot of theories but no smoking gun.
        Jimmc414 5y ago
        I'm not buying that. Sure there might be some unknown metabolic factors at play, but it seems disingenuous to overlook the ratio of calories consumed to calories expended.
  - fernandotakai 5y ago
    you can't smoke inside anymore (honestly, nowadays you can only smoke outside and at your own place, and even then, some rentals prohibit smoking) -- that's was a "mandate" to decrease smoking related diseases.
  - rsynnott 5y ago
    It's a significant topic of concern, and governments have been restricting the tobacco industry more and more since the 80s. Most developed countries now ban indoor smoking and the advertisement of tobacco; some are getting ready to ban tobacco outright.
webdood90 5y ago
The point is to reduce critical cases that cause hospital visits. Our system is overwhelmed as is. The fact that this still needs to be explained 2 years into this is ridiculous.
- MarkLowenstein 5y ago
  Was that really the point? When people anxiously awaited their chance to get the vaccine in January 2021, were they thinking "ooh I can't wait to free up hospital beds"? Or was it "great now I can be immune and be done with COVID"?
  - IneffablePigeon 5y ago
    I mean, both? I think the vast majority of people I knew (UK, in my 20s) knew that the main reason we were locked down was to minimize the risk of the NHS being so overrun it couldn't perform basic healthcare. Of course personally we all just wanted to not be locked down any more but I don't actually think that many of us were staying in for our own sakes - we knew the long term risk to our own health if we were to catch it was fairly low. Very biased sample, of course.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- someguy5344523 5y ago
  If the system is overwhelmed, then hospitals shouldn't have fired workers who didn't want to get vaccinated.
- spookthesunset 5y ago
  > Our system is overwhelmed as is. I have yet to see proof that most of the system is "overwhelmed". Sure there are hotspots here and there but this idea that the system is on the brink of collapse is hyperbole. And even if it is true, these dudes had 2 years of our time to figure out how to deal with it. 2 years of our short lives we've given so they could fix this capacity issue. Where is the results? Why is it the general public's fault at this point?

But it looks like the vaccines don't stop the spread of covid: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC8481107/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC8481107/

soperj 5y ago

They stop the hospitals from filling up though.

Jimmc414 5y ago
Tobacco kills 8 million of its users, annually. Why is their presence in ICU beds not a topic of concern?
- mgh2 5y ago
  I will think because it is not contagious and does not affect the global economy as such
- amanaplanacanal 5y ago
  Probably because that number is fairly stable over time. Beds exist for that load. A new load is a problem, because staffed hospital beds take time to create. It takes years to make a new nurse or doctor, for instance.
  - rajin444 5y ago
    Why can’t we just group antivaxxers with smokers then? We’ve ignored the obesity problem for a long time and are taking 0 steps to correct after we’ve seen our health systems buckle in no small part due to it. If you’re in favor of mandates but not forced weight loss you’re just playing politics. Yes, one is easier than the other, but the magnitude of good done by reducing obesity dwarfs the good done by vaccines. If the US had ignored Covid and focused solely on obesity we would likely have been better off in terms of all cause mortality.
    - amanaplanacanal 5y ago
      Nobody knows what is causing the obesity epidemic, unfortunately. There are a lot of theories but no smoking gun.
      - Jimmc414 5y ago
        I'm not buying that. Sure there might be some unknown metabolic factors at play, but it seems disingenuous to overlook the ratio of calories consumed to calories expended.
- fernandotakai 5y ago
  you can't smoke inside anymore (honestly, nowadays you can only smoke outside and at your own place, and even then, some rentals prohibit smoking) -- that's was a "mandate" to decrease smoking related diseases.
- rsynnott 5y ago
  It's a significant topic of concern, and governments have been restricting the tobacco industry more and more since the 80s. Most developed countries now ban indoor smoking and the advertisement of tobacco; some are getting ready to ban tobacco outright.

webdood90 5y ago

The point is to reduce critical cases that cause hospital visits. Our system is overwhelmed as is. The fact that this still needs to be explained 2 years into this is ridiculous.

MarkLowenstein 5y ago
Was that really the point? When people anxiously awaited their chance to get the vaccine in January 2021, were they thinking "ooh I can't wait to free up hospital beds"? Or was it "great now I can be immune and be done with COVID"?
- IneffablePigeon 5y ago
  I mean, both? I think the vast majority of people I knew (UK, in my 20s) knew that the main reason we were locked down was to minimize the risk of the NHS being so overrun it couldn't perform basic healthcare. Of course personally we all just wanted to not be locked down any more but I don't actually think that many of us were staying in for our own sakes - we knew the long term risk to our own health if we were to catch it was fairly low. Very biased sample, of course.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
someguy5344523 5y ago
If the system is overwhelmed, then hospitals shouldn't have fired workers who didn't want to get vaccinated.
spookthesunset 5y ago
> Our system is overwhelmed as is. I have yet to see proof that most of the system is "overwhelmed". Sure there are hotspots here and there but this idea that the system is on the brink of collapse is hyperbole. And even if it is true, these dudes had 2 years of our time to figure out how to deal with it. 2 years of our short lives we've given so they could fix this capacity issue. Where is the results? Why is it the general public's fault at this point?