4 ms·

China's pandemic is not over. They are still having outbreaks. Many of my family members spent the past several weeks and months in quarantine prisons, by force

China's pandemic is not over. They are still having outbreaks. Many of my family members spent the past several weeks and months in quarantine prisons, by force. I, like many others, refrain from speaking on the subject because commentary is illegal and my family could be persecuted for my discussing it. I will instead say that I believe your view is incredibly naive and you are fortunate to have your naivety be legal to voice. Read between the lines here and understand that I believe there is a lot to say that cannot be said.

tablespoon 5y ago
> China's pandemic is not over. They are still having outbreaks. Many of my family members spent the past several weeks and months in quarantine prisons, by force. I understand that, and their strategy is no longer tenable with Omicron. However, I think it's also proof that lockdowns and masks could have ended the pandemic before Omicron or Delta variants developed, if they had been implemented rigorously and early enough. So it's only correct to claim that "half-ass mask mandates and lockdowns failed to end the pandemic." One of the irritating things is that a lot of people who now claim mask mandates and lockdowns don't work were also the people who were sabotaging them, and they failed in large part because of that sabotage.
- champagnois 5y ago
  >>their strategy is no longer tenable It was never tenable. >>It was proof that lockdowns and masks could have ended the pandemic Research in January of 2020 indicated that the virus was known to species hop with ease. Research also indicated there was ample evidence of animal population reservoirs of virus. Thus, any lockdown of human populations, even quarantining us to different planets, would be irrelevant. Animal populations would function as reservoirs that will bring the virus back to a stage of infecting us as soon as we come out of hiding. >>if they had been implemented rigorously and early enough. This is a completely bonkers view point (as it has no basis in science) and it is sadly the view of many people who have been conditioned to believe authority figures are infallible. >> irritating things is that a lot of people who now claim mask mandates and lockdowns don't work were also the people who were sabotaging them, and they failed in large part because of that sabotage. The virus is airborne. It travels between 27-42 feet in the air. Proper PPE in the quantities needed does not exist. Social distancing at 6 feet? Pseudoscientific recommendation coming from pre-covid infection control practices designed to prevent the spread of influenza droplets (which are known to travel less than six feet). Paper masks? Cloth masks? Pseudoscientific recommendation coming from a government wanting to be percieved as doing something. Every professional knows none of that gear is rated or known to stop viral transmission. Even a properly used N95 has a very short lifespan proportionate to the electric charge on the cloth material (which can fade after minutes of use, at which point, when the charged sides of the mask lose their charge, the filtration of viral particles ends despite the masks bulkier size). >>Locking people in their homes, welding them into prisons, shooting people who violate curfew? etc?? Draconian, pseudoscientific shit that has no place in any society or civilization. It also didn't work. In all societies, regardless of these pseudoscientific measures being implemented or not, the virus still spread. I guess you can use the virus as fuel for your hatred of some political adversary and scapegoat them for the virus. Apes and authoritarians have been doing that for all of human history with many different viruses. >> About me? Come from a family of doctors. Ran a team at a viral research lab in a very relevant country. Have done graduate study in virology. Have attended various infection control and pandemic response seminars prior to the pandemic. Have dealt with SARS and MERS in person prior to covid. I, like many others, have had these positions since January 2020. Educated professionals who talk of facts are constantly silenced or bullied or threatened by authoritarian systems. I do not matter and my background does not give my comments merit. The comments more or less stand on their own.
  - tablespoon 5y ago
    >> their strategy is no longer tenable > It was never tenable. I disagree. And even if it couldn't 100% eradicate the virus, those strategies certainly seemed capable enough to limit it until vaccines could be brought strongly to bear. However, that runs into another area where many people seem to be more interested in sabotaging things in order to be "proven" right. > Research in January of 2020 indicated that the virus was known to species hop with ease. > Research also indicated there was ample evidence of animal population reservoirs of virus. So, for quite some time China (and several other countries), had locally eradicated the virus in the human population. Is there any evidence that those animal reservoirs were a source of reinfection in those places? > Come from a family of doctors. Ran a team at a viral research lab in a very relevant country. Have done graduate study in virology. Have attended various infection control and pandemic response seminars prior to the pandemic. Have dealt with SARS and MERS in person prior to covid. And I get the strong impression your views are mostly derived from political beliefs rather than professional ones, dispute the credential dropping and appeals to "science." You're basically disputing every virus control measure proposed, despite the glaring evidence that they worked for quite some time in some areas. By the way, have you participated in a video where they collect anyone they can manage with a shred of a medical of scientific credential to read some statement about how "masks don't work", "vaccines are dangerous", etc.? I've seen a bunch of those claiming all kinds of things. > I do not matter and my background does not give my comments merit. That's definitely true.
    - champagnois 5y ago
      >>disputing every virus control measure proposed, despite the glaring evidence that they worked Not only did the measures not work, they were doomed to fail from the start and could not have possibly worked. You've provided little more than your own disagreement, but no supporting arguments as to why. Political leaders and authorities knew this, but acted in the ways that they did for their own reasons. My position here puts me at odds with political partisans, but not scientists.
      - tablespoon 5y ago

tablespoon 5y ago

> China's pandemic is not over. They are still having outbreaks. Many of my family members spent the past several weeks and months in quarantine prisons, by force. I understand that, and their strategy is no longer tenable with Omicron. However, I think it's also proof that lockdowns and masks could have ended the pandemic before Omicron or Delta variants developed, if they had been implemented rigorously and early enough. So it's only correct to claim that "half-ass mask mandates and lockdowns failed to end the pandemic." One of the irritating things is that a lot of people who now claim mask mandates and lockdowns don't work were also the people who were sabotaging them, and they failed in large part because of that sabotage.

champagnois 5y ago
>>their strategy is no longer tenable It was never tenable. >>It was proof that lockdowns and masks could have ended the pandemic Research in January of 2020 indicated that the virus was known to species hop with ease. Research also indicated there was ample evidence of animal population reservoirs of virus. Thus, any lockdown of human populations, even quarantining us to different planets, would be irrelevant. Animal populations would function as reservoirs that will bring the virus back to a stage of infecting us as soon as we come out of hiding. >>if they had been implemented rigorously and early enough. This is a completely bonkers view point (as it has no basis in science) and it is sadly the view of many people who have been conditioned to believe authority figures are infallible. >> irritating things is that a lot of people who now claim mask mandates and lockdowns don't work were also the people who were sabotaging them, and they failed in large part because of that sabotage. The virus is airborne. It travels between 27-42 feet in the air. Proper PPE in the quantities needed does not exist. Social distancing at 6 feet? Pseudoscientific recommendation coming from pre-covid infection control practices designed to prevent the spread of influenza droplets (which are known to travel less than six feet). Paper masks? Cloth masks? Pseudoscientific recommendation coming from a government wanting to be percieved as doing something. Every professional knows none of that gear is rated or known to stop viral transmission. Even a properly used N95 has a very short lifespan proportionate to the electric charge on the cloth material (which can fade after minutes of use, at which point, when the charged sides of the mask lose their charge, the filtration of viral particles ends despite the masks bulkier size). >>Locking people in their homes, welding them into prisons, shooting people who violate curfew? etc?? Draconian, pseudoscientific shit that has no place in any society or civilization. It also didn't work. In all societies, regardless of these pseudoscientific measures being implemented or not, the virus still spread. I guess you can use the virus as fuel for your hatred of some political adversary and scapegoat them for the virus. Apes and authoritarians have been doing that for all of human history with many different viruses. >> About me? Come from a family of doctors. Ran a team at a viral research lab in a very relevant country. Have done graduate study in virology. Have attended various infection control and pandemic response seminars prior to the pandemic. Have dealt with SARS and MERS in person prior to covid. I, like many others, have had these positions since January 2020. Educated professionals who talk of facts are constantly silenced or bullied or threatened by authoritarian systems. I do not matter and my background does not give my comments merit. The comments more or less stand on their own.
- tablespoon 5y ago
  >> their strategy is no longer tenable > It was never tenable. I disagree. And even if it couldn't 100% eradicate the virus, those strategies certainly seemed capable enough to limit it until vaccines could be brought strongly to bear. However, that runs into another area where many people seem to be more interested in sabotaging things in order to be "proven" right. > Research in January of 2020 indicated that the virus was known to species hop with ease. > Research also indicated there was ample evidence of animal population reservoirs of virus. So, for quite some time China (and several other countries), had locally eradicated the virus in the human population. Is there any evidence that those animal reservoirs were a source of reinfection in those places? > Come from a family of doctors. Ran a team at a viral research lab in a very relevant country. Have done graduate study in virology. Have attended various infection control and pandemic response seminars prior to the pandemic. Have dealt with SARS and MERS in person prior to covid. And I get the strong impression your views are mostly derived from political beliefs rather than professional ones, dispute the credential dropping and appeals to "science." You're basically disputing every virus control measure proposed, despite the glaring evidence that they worked for quite some time in some areas. By the way, have you participated in a video where they collect anyone they can manage with a shred of a medical of scientific credential to read some statement about how "masks don't work", "vaccines are dangerous", etc.? I've seen a bunch of those claiming all kinds of things. > I do not matter and my background does not give my comments merit. That's definitely true.
  - champagnois 5y ago
    >>disputing every virus control measure proposed, despite the glaring evidence that they worked Not only did the measures not work, they were doomed to fail from the start and could not have possibly worked. You've provided little more than your own disagreement, but no supporting arguments as to why. Political leaders and authorities knew this, but acted in the ways that they did for their own reasons. My position here puts me at odds with political partisans, but not scientists.
    - tablespoon 5y ago