4 ms·

This is something that doesn't get talked about often and i'm glad you brought it up. For all its flaws, the US (and Canada) are societies built around inclusi

This is something that doesn't get talked about often and i'm glad you brought it up. For all its flaws, the US (and Canada) are societies built around inclusion. Anyone can become American or Canadian and they have. In North America, you are allowed to retain your original identity and flaunt your culture. In Europe, you must become only French, or only Dutch or only Italian. Your original identity is often erased. Europe is a society fractured along lines of ethnicity and don't let anyone here tell you that ethnicity is not a huge part of identity. In europe, you are merely tolerated, you will never truly integrate and be accepted as "one of us". This is very evident in the words of non-white footballers like Ziyech and Ozil, one of whom is an EU citizen but plays for an African country. "Us" in the European context involves a specific ethnicity and this fact is very evident to people of colour in Europe. You can certainly find individual europeans who buck this trend but the overall pressure from society is very different and this is the aspect a lot of people miss. While europe's quality of life is great, what i'm getting at is a long-term problem that cannot be solved. And mind you, this is true everywhere in the old world as every society there is built around ethnicity.

oaiey 5y ago
While being a bit harsh, this is indeed overall one of the biggest issues foreigners actually have: if you accept language and culture and adapt yourself into it, you love it. If you reject it Europe/that country is not your place. You will never feel home then or create a social web outside of the expat community. I have seen so many cases of both cases here in Europe.
- eldaisfish 5y ago
  For the record - the point you appear to be making is that language and culture are the only two components of societal acceptance. I am arguing that in a society based around ethnicity, ethnicity is another important part of societal acceptance. This is not harsh, this is reality. Do you remember the reaction from French media and even the French ambassador to the US when a comedian pointed out that Africans won the 2018 football world cup? The defining characteristic of all their reactions was an attempt to erase or deny the African origins of footballers like Pogba, Kante, Kounde, Ben Yedder etc.
nafizh 5y ago
Thank you for beautifully putting the main difference between US and Europe. This is quite accurate in terms of how US and Europe see immigrants.
_theory_ 5y ago
I have no doubt you're correct, however if the same model were applied in the US it would automatically be seen as racist. And I know you use the word 'ethnicity,' but I posit that no one over here thinks in such nuanced terms, so you'd still end up with the conclusion that this way of living is racist. Which I suppose says something: maybe race concerns are so highlighted in the US precisely because we do aim to be more inclusive over all.

oaiey 5y ago

While being a bit harsh, this is indeed overall one of the biggest issues foreigners actually have: if you accept language and culture and adapt yourself into it, you love it. If you reject it Europe/that country is not your place. You will never feel home then or create a social web outside of the expat community. I have seen so many cases of both cases here in Europe.

eldaisfish 5y ago
For the record - the point you appear to be making is that language and culture are the only two components of societal acceptance. I am arguing that in a society based around ethnicity, ethnicity is another important part of societal acceptance. This is not harsh, this is reality. Do you remember the reaction from French media and even the French ambassador to the US when a comedian pointed out that Africans won the 2018 football world cup? The defining characteristic of all their reactions was an attempt to erase or deny the African origins of footballers like Pogba, Kante, Kounde, Ben Yedder etc.

nafizh 5y ago

Thank you for beautifully putting the main difference between US and Europe. This is quite accurate in terms of how US and Europe see immigrants.

_theory_ 5y ago

I have no doubt you're correct, however if the same model were applied in the US it would automatically be seen as racist. And I know you use the word 'ethnicity,' but I posit that no one over here thinks in such nuanced terms, so you'd still end up with the conclusion that this way of living is racist. Which I suppose says something: maybe race concerns are so highlighted in the US precisely because we do aim to be more inclusive over all.