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I was planning to move the other way before Covid - from Sweden to California. It's much less likely now as I have a stable position and my partner lost her job
by nivenkos 5y ago
I was planning to move the other way before Covid - from Sweden to California. It's much less likely now as I have a stable position and my partner lost her job in the US.
Mainly the US has many benefits:
- Much, much higher salaries - like 2-3x higher than Western Europe _before_ income tax!
- Much larger houses for the price. i.e. you can have a big house with room for hobbies or children rather than just a small flat.
- Lower prices on a lot of fixed-price goods - cars, electronics, fuel, electricity, natural gas, etc.
- Lower income and sales tax so you can save for a property and retirement. This is really tough in Europe, the sort of Tech FIRE culture doesn't exist due to that - wealth is primarily inherited.
The downsides are:
- It's a necessity to drive, but at least outside the big cities it's a lot easier than Europe overall (big, wide, straight roads and automatic cars).
- Healthcare is tied to your employer so it can be incredibly risky when moving as an immigrant since until you get a Green Card, you are tied to the one employer (good luck negotiating a raise!). Note that in most Tech companies, the health insurance gives you better coverage than public systems in Europe (e.g. covering dentistry and annual checkups).
- Less stability in employment - at-will employment, lower unemployment payments (except vs. the UK), no trade unions in Tech.
- Safety in some areas wrt. gun crime, etc. - you have to choose where you live and work very carefully.
- Backwards in some technology (online payments, card payments, digitisation of government services vs. the UK and Scandinavia for example).
A main decision point would be if you have kids. Europe is great to move to if you've already saved a lot in the US, can move to Europe and buy a house outright, get permanent residency and then have children and benefit from better paternal leave and even universal child benefit payments (Kindergeld/Barnbidrag, etc.)
Whereas if you are child-free, and don't already have enough savings to buy property, it's going to be harder to achieve that in Europe IMO.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- pizza234 5y ago> Much, much higher salaries - like 2-3x higher than Western Europe _before_ income tax! Where does this number come from? Assuming SWE, a senior SWE in Europe will generally take around 80/120k € (non-FAANG). 2-3x means a range of 180/400k $, which is not common even in the USA.
- VirusNewbie 5y agomaking 180k in the US is not uncommon for senior level people in medium CoL places. I make more then that at a small startup. If I move to a larger company I'd make more and even more so if I get a FAANG job.
- nivenkos 5y ago> a senior SWE in Europe will generally take around 80/120k € (non-FAANG) Nowhere near - I got 75k EUR at a FAANG (whilst the same position in the US paid ~$165k USD - the levels were public). I now get 86k EUR in one of the most expensive countries in Europe (with over 40% tax rate too). But most Tech salaries are much lower, I started on the equivalent of $40k USD for example, and it's common for people to level out around $65-70k USD.
- burntoutfire 5y agoLooks like you're underpaid, if you shop around 86k EUR is what you can get paid in Poland, doing remote work, and paying 12% income taxes...
- ojl 5y agoI think you covered most stuff pretty well. > Much, much higher salaries - like 2-3x higher than Western Europe _before_ income tax! > Much larger houses for the price. i.e. you can have a big house with room for hobbies or children rather than just a small flat. But remember that in those parts of the US where people have those very high salaries, people seem to complain about not being able to afford to buy a house at all. Should be less of a problem nowadays with remote work though.