4 ms·

Is Germany a Reliable American Ally? Nein.

5 points by cwwc 5y ago

hourislate 5y ago
I'd like to see the USA pull completely out of Germany 100% and move all of those bases, troops, etc into Eastern Europe. They will be warmly greeted and greatly appreciated. I would even go as far as giving Germany a way out of NATO and letting them go it alone.
- JoeyBananas 5y ago
  The fact that we have so many service members stationed in Germany that nobody ever thinks about makes the Afghanistan pull-out look so much more stupid in hindsight.
  - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
    > makes the Afghanistan pull-out look so much more stupid in hindsight Germans aren't blowing up American service members. The legitimate government of Germany maintains an invitation to those forces. And there is clear and present strategic American interest to the role those forces serve. None of those applied to Afghanistan. Doesn't mean the pull-out was correct, just that Germany's situation is too different for comparison.
    - JoeyBananas 5y ago
      If there's no immediate danger in Germany and the government is stable, why do they need to be there? Why not send them to Afghanistan where there is a bunch of work to be done?
Arnt 5y ago
Certainly Germany's not a reliable ally for the USA. But the rest of the analysis seems wrong. For example, it doesn't realise how important Nord Stream is for the Russian state finances. Russia is about to learn a lesson many EU countries have learned. Germany willingly pays (for gas or whatever). And later, the decisions made are ones acceptable to Germany. https://archive.fo/BLOUm https://archive.fo/BLOUm BTW.
qnsi 5y ago
I dont understand German elites and I guess I should better, when Germany is my country's main economic partner. I think they are being deeply lobbied by their industry who wants to keep doing business with Russia and China. Merkel has been seen this cheerful lady, but she blocked EU actions against Poland for years and I lost all respect to her due to this.
vanusa 5y ago
But while the intelligence flights have transited German airspace—the most direct route between Britain and Ukraine—the weapons flights have been making detours around Germany. Britain’s Defense Ministry played down the detours, confirming that it didn’t seek overflight permission. But that’s the point: Britain didn’t ask because that would have forced Germany to grant or reject the request. Britain believed the decision would be difficult for Chancellor Olaf Scholz’s new government. Which is interesting because despite the Red-Green "opposition" to the 2003 invasion of Iraq - they gave a full green light to the U.S. to uses its air bases in their country (most principally the EUCOM headquarters in Stuttgart) to conduct all manor of offensive operations in the course of that overtly aggressive and basically criminal undertaking. On top of a long history of selling arms to any number of despotic regimes (most notably Egypt, Qaddafi's Libya), or regimes slightly less despotic but engaged in long-term offensive operations against their own citizenry (Turkey), sometimes in violation of its own regulations against such transfers. Which makes its newly discovered vigilance and sense of "principle" in regard to transfers to Ukraine seem quite suspect.

5 points by cwwc 5y ago

I'd like to see the USA pull completely out of Germany 100% and move all of those bases, troops, etc into Eastern Europe. They will be warmly greeted and greatly appreciated. I would even go as far as giving Germany a way out of NATO and letting them go it alone.

JoeyBananas 5y ago
The fact that we have so many service members stationed in Germany that nobody ever thinks about makes the Afghanistan pull-out look so much more stupid in hindsight.
- JumpCrisscross 5y ago
  > makes the Afghanistan pull-out look so much more stupid in hindsight Germans aren't blowing up American service members. The legitimate government of Germany maintains an invitation to those forces. And there is clear and present strategic American interest to the role those forces serve. None of those applied to Afghanistan. Doesn't mean the pull-out was correct, just that Germany's situation is too different for comparison.
  - JoeyBananas 5y ago
    If there's no immediate danger in Germany and the government is stable, why do they need to be there? Why not send them to Afghanistan where there is a bunch of work to be done?

Arnt 5y ago

Certainly Germany's not a reliable ally for the USA. But the rest of the analysis seems wrong. For example, it doesn't realise how important Nord Stream is for the Russian state finances. Russia is about to learn a lesson many EU countries have learned. Germany willingly pays (for gas or whatever). And later, the decisions made are ones acceptable to Germany. https://archive.fo/BLOUm https://archive.fo/BLOUm BTW.

qnsi 5y ago

I dont understand German elites and I guess I should better, when Germany is my country's main economic partner. I think they are being deeply lobbied by their industry who wants to keep doing business with Russia and China. Merkel has been seen this cheerful lady, but she blocked EU actions against Poland for years and I lost all respect to her due to this.

vanusa 5y ago

But while the intelligence flights have transited German airspace—the most direct route between Britain and Ukraine—the weapons flights have been making detours around Germany. Britain’s Defense Ministry played down the detours, confirming that it didn’t seek overflight permission. But that’s the point: Britain didn’t ask because that would have forced Germany to grant or reject the request. Britain believed the decision would be difficult for Chancellor Olaf Scholz’s new government. Which is interesting because despite the Red-Green "opposition" to the 2003 invasion of Iraq - they gave a full green light to the U.S. to uses its air bases in their country (most principally the EUCOM headquarters in Stuttgart) to conduct all manor of offensive operations in the course of that overtly aggressive and basically criminal undertaking. On top of a long history of selling arms to any number of despotic regimes (most notably Egypt, Qaddafi's Libya), or regimes slightly less despotic but engaged in long-term offensive operations against their own citizenry (Turkey), sometimes in violation of its own regulations against such transfers. Which makes its newly discovered vigilance and sense of "principle" in regard to transfers to Ukraine seem quite suspect.