5 ms·

I don't support robocall spammers, even if their tech stacks might contain interesting nuggets. At best your typical crypto project is just a planet-destroying

by nikanj 5y ago

I don't support robocall spammers, even if their tech stacks might contain interesting nuggets. At best your typical crypto project is just a planet-destroying unregulated casino, at worst it's criminal fraud. I don't care that it might contain cool tech. The same goes for e.g. ransomware. It might be innovative. It's still a huge blight on humanity.

jsharf 5y ago
Usually I hate skeptical mean comments like this on hackernews. Right or wrong, there's a certain level of empathy missing. And yet... In this case I find myself guiltily agreeing.
- kerneloftruth 5y ago
  I don't see anything mean in the comment, and I also fully agree (it's really well-stated). Being direct and not mincing words is not being mean.
  - capableweb 5y ago
    It's not mean, it's just very skewed in one way without acknowledging different perspectives. Take this sentence: > At best your typical crypto project is just a planet-destroying unregulated casino, at worst it's criminal fraud Obviously the "at best" part is still a negative, just like the "at worst". That's no way of starting a curious conversation and frankly, it makes for boring reading no matter if you're for/against cryptocurrencies as a whole.
    - akiselev 5y ago
      Pointing out that a spade is a spade does make for boring reading. I don't understand what more there is to say about NFTs but maybe I'm just taking crazy pills.
- A_non_e-moose 5y ago
  Skepticism is like an anchor, too much and you go nowhere, too little and you're adrift. The interesting questions are how much and where do you place your skepticism? NFTs sound enough alarms for me that I feel the need to drop anchor on that before steering to any BS with potential financial consequences.
  - kongolongo 5y ago
    I think if you're going to support anything - crypto or otherwise, you should start with some level of skepticism, if it can overcome that initial skepticism then maybe it is worth believing in, otherwise remain skeptical imo.
smoldesu 5y ago
Unfortunately, I kinda feel the same way. I'm a blockchain apologist for the most part, whenever I hear people complaining about how the blockchain is some kind of automated discrimination process I cringe a little bit and try my hardest to explain to them that the technology itself is neither good nor evil, just implemented pretty poorly. With that being said, I generally cannot stand cryptocurrency. I have yet to meet a single starry-eyed crypto fanatic who wasn't either woefully uninformed or completely jaded by their investment. I'm not sure if I'd go as far as calling it a "huge blight on humanity" (any more than I'd call Denmark a huge blight on humanity for existing and consuming electricity/food), but digital money is indeed a sucker's game these days.
steelstraw 5y ago
Bitcoin and crypto might seem unnecessary in a democracy with a stable currency and it's easy to focus on the scams. But in countries with deeply unstable economies and authoritarian politics, it is a lifeline. Bitcoin has been used by dissidents and activists in places like Cuba, Nigeria, and Belarus. In Russia, the country’s most prominent opposition politician and Putin critic, Alexei Navaly, has raised millions in Bitcoin. Putin can do a lot of things, but he can't freeze a bitcoin account. If you want to understand what crypto is really about, ask Venezuelans if they’d rather own bolívar or Bitcoin. And with creeping authoritarianism in the West, and the USD inflating and at risk of losing global reserve currency status (petrodollar), I wouldn't be so confident it'll never happen here.
- acdha 5y ago
  Don’t forget to ask them again after they learn how helpful Bitcoin is to the police. Once it’s big enough to care about, leaving a signed confession is not a good idea.
- CPLX 5y ago
  > Putin can do a lot of things, but he can't freeze a bitcoin account. He can if he's got the private key.
  - imglorp 5y ago
    Even if he can't freeze it, he has access to the public ledger and with some effort can figure out who sent money to whom. Either of those two parties could then get a visit and politely invited to reveal the other. If you want (more?) anonymous you need Monero or Zerocoin.
  - toss1 5y ago
    ... and Putin has lots of thugs happy to wield USD$5 (RUB 388) wrenches to obtain those private keys, and the globally known precedent of the year-long torture & murder of Sergi Magnitsky to let the key-holders know that there's no way out.
- boringg 5y ago
intev 5y ago
> I don't care that it might contain cool tech. As a tech enthusiast, that's just sad to hear.
- minimaxir 5y ago
  Any cool innovations genuinely offered in good faith by web3/crypto are confounded by all the bad actors.
- BugsJustFindMe 5y ago
  If you think that's sad, wait until you hear about the people who give crimes against society and the planet the "ok" because they involve cool tech.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
ddrdrck_ 5y ago
There is crypto ecosystems that do not use PoW (proof-of-work, ala Bitcoin) but other consensus schemes (most notably proof-of-stake, e.g. Cosmos) that do not destroy the planet. Unregulated casino with eco-friendly tech is quite nice actually. No government should be able to forbid me to gamble imho.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
dang 5y ago
Please don't post shallow-indignant flamewar comments, regardless of how right you are or feel you are. It makes for dumbed-down, tedious internet threads, and we'd prefer to avoid those. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

by nikanj 5y ago

jsharf 5y ago

Usually I hate skeptical mean comments like this on hackernews. Right or wrong, there's a certain level of empathy missing. And yet... In this case I find myself guiltily agreeing.

kerneloftruth 5y ago
I don't see anything mean in the comment, and I also fully agree (it's really well-stated). Being direct and not mincing words is not being mean.
- capableweb 5y ago
  It's not mean, it's just very skewed in one way without acknowledging different perspectives. Take this sentence: > At best your typical crypto project is just a planet-destroying unregulated casino, at worst it's criminal fraud Obviously the "at best" part is still a negative, just like the "at worst". That's no way of starting a curious conversation and frankly, it makes for boring reading no matter if you're for/against cryptocurrencies as a whole.
  - akiselev 5y ago
    Pointing out that a spade is a spade does make for boring reading. I don't understand what more there is to say about NFTs but maybe I'm just taking crazy pills.
A_non_e-moose 5y ago
Skepticism is like an anchor, too much and you go nowhere, too little and you're adrift. The interesting questions are how much and where do you place your skepticism? NFTs sound enough alarms for me that I feel the need to drop anchor on that before steering to any BS with potential financial consequences.
- kongolongo 5y ago
  I think if you're going to support anything - crypto or otherwise, you should start with some level of skepticism, if it can overcome that initial skepticism then maybe it is worth believing in, otherwise remain skeptical imo.

smoldesu 5y ago

Unfortunately, I kinda feel the same way. I'm a blockchain apologist for the most part, whenever I hear people complaining about how the blockchain is some kind of automated discrimination process I cringe a little bit and try my hardest to explain to them that the technology itself is neither good nor evil, just implemented pretty poorly. With that being said, I generally cannot stand cryptocurrency. I have yet to meet a single starry-eyed crypto fanatic who wasn't either woefully uninformed or completely jaded by their investment. I'm not sure if I'd go as far as calling it a "huge blight on humanity" (any more than I'd call Denmark a huge blight on humanity for existing and consuming electricity/food), but digital money is indeed a sucker's game these days.

steelstraw 5y ago

Bitcoin and crypto might seem unnecessary in a democracy with a stable currency and it's easy to focus on the scams. But in countries with deeply unstable economies and authoritarian politics, it is a lifeline. Bitcoin has been used by dissidents and activists in places like Cuba, Nigeria, and Belarus. In Russia, the country’s most prominent opposition politician and Putin critic, Alexei Navaly, has raised millions in Bitcoin. Putin can do a lot of things, but he can't freeze a bitcoin account. If you want to understand what crypto is really about, ask Venezuelans if they’d rather own bolívar or Bitcoin. And with creeping authoritarianism in the West, and the USD inflating and at risk of losing global reserve currency status (petrodollar), I wouldn't be so confident it'll never happen here.

acdha 5y ago
Don’t forget to ask them again after they learn how helpful Bitcoin is to the police. Once it’s big enough to care about, leaving a signed confession is not a good idea.
CPLX 5y ago
> Putin can do a lot of things, but he can't freeze a bitcoin account. He can if he's got the private key.
- imglorp 5y ago
  Even if he can't freeze it, he has access to the public ledger and with some effort can figure out who sent money to whom. Either of those two parties could then get a visit and politely invited to reveal the other. If you want (more?) anonymous you need Monero or Zerocoin.
- toss1 5y ago
  ... and Putin has lots of thugs happy to wield USD$5 (RUB 388) wrenches to obtain those private keys, and the globally known precedent of the year-long torture & murder of Sergi Magnitsky to let the key-holders know that there's no way out.
boringg 5y ago

intev 5y ago

> I don't care that it might contain cool tech. As a tech enthusiast, that's just sad to hear.

minimaxir 5y ago
Any cool innovations genuinely offered in good faith by web3/crypto are confounded by all the bad actors.
BugsJustFindMe 5y ago
If you think that's sad, wait until you hear about the people who give crimes against society and the planet the "ok" because they involve cool tech.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

ddrdrck_ 5y ago

There is crypto ecosystems that do not use PoW (proof-of-work, ala Bitcoin) but other consensus schemes (most notably proof-of-stake, e.g. Cosmos) that do not destroy the planet. Unregulated casino with eco-friendly tech is quite nice actually. No government should be able to forbid me to gamble imho.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

dang 5y ago

Please don't post shallow-indignant flamewar comments, regardless of how right you are or feel you are. It makes for dumbed-down, tedious internet threads, and we'd prefer to avoid those. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html