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France and the UK don't have an economic and political problem like the US has at the moment. Which is why they have no reason to "change the narrative" by dist

by kesor 5y ago

France and the UK don't have an economic and political problem like the US has at the moment. Which is why they have no reason to "change the narrative" by distracting the public with useless wars. There are zero US interests to protect in and around Ukraine, so all of this looks like unwarranted poking of a lion/shark/whatever.

iamstupidsimple 5y ago
France and the UK aren't in political crisis? Did we forget about Brexit and COVID so quickly? Same deal with yellow vests in France.
octopoc 5y ago
1. Starting a war with Russia is not the goal here. Deterring Russia is the goal. 2. A war with Russia wouldn't be a proxy war and it wouldn't be anything like Afghanistan or Iraq. It could quickly become nuclear. It's not the same as America's wars in Afghanistan or Iraq. 3. You're implying that Russia is not a threat to Europe even if America stopped using its military to deter Russia from conquering Europe. I don't think that's correct. If Russia believed it could conquer parts of Europe tomorrow, they would probably try. They don't care about public opinion in western countries.
- deleted 5y ago
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- deepsun 5y ago
  > could conquer parts of Europe tomorrow, they would probably try And they do try (and succeed) all the time: Crimea, Eastern Ukraine, South Osetia, Abkhazia, Transnistria.
jeswin 5y ago
> There are zero US interests to protect in and around Ukraine, so all of this looks like unwarranted poking of a lion/shark/whatever. Not everything is about self interest - free people have a moral obligation defend freedom. Inaction on Ukraine will be especially egregious after taking away Ukraine's nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees.
datavirtue 5y ago
Tons of business/trade with Ukraine that will evaporate immediately. Trade promotes peace and unity. This alone is enough to raise this as a political issue in the US. The same thing with the other NATO countries right now.

by kesor 5y ago

iamstupidsimple 5y ago

France and the UK aren't in political crisis? Did we forget about Brexit and COVID so quickly? Same deal with yellow vests in France.

octopoc 5y ago

1. Starting a war with Russia is not the goal here. Deterring Russia is the goal. 2. A war with Russia wouldn't be a proxy war and it wouldn't be anything like Afghanistan or Iraq. It could quickly become nuclear. It's not the same as America's wars in Afghanistan or Iraq. 3. You're implying that Russia is not a threat to Europe even if America stopped using its military to deter Russia from conquering Europe. I don't think that's correct. If Russia believed it could conquer parts of Europe tomorrow, they would probably try. They don't care about public opinion in western countries.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
deepsun 5y ago
> could conquer parts of Europe tomorrow, they would probably try And they do try (and succeed) all the time: Crimea, Eastern Ukraine, South Osetia, Abkhazia, Transnistria.

jeswin 5y ago

> There are zero US interests to protect in and around Ukraine, so all of this looks like unwarranted poking of a lion/shark/whatever. Not everything is about self interest - free people have a moral obligation defend freedom. Inaction on Ukraine will be especially egregious after taking away Ukraine's nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees.

datavirtue 5y ago

Tons of business/trade with Ukraine that will evaporate immediately. Trade promotes peace and unity. This alone is enough to raise this as a political issue in the US. The same thing with the other NATO countries right now.