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Fastmail looks great, but having "Get the email features you need, without giving up your privacy" and "Your data is always private" at the top of their homepag

by miles 5y ago

Fastmail looks great, but having "Get the email features you need, without giving up your privacy" and "Your data is always private" at the top of their homepage while knowing full well that is far from the case[0,1] seems disingenuous. [0] FastMail loses customers, faces calls to move over anti-encryption laws https://www.itnews.com.au/news/fastmail-loses-customers-faces-calls-to-move-over-anti-encryption-laws-519783 https://www.itnews.com.au/news/fastmail-loses-customers-face... [1] Goodbye FastMail https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/goodbye-fastmail.html https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/goodbye-fastmail.html

YPPH 5y ago
Fastmail is not a zero-knowledge service. Unless I'm missing something, anti-encryption laws seem to be irrelevant, since they don't really change the position at all. I suppose hypothetically if Fastmail was a zero-knowledge service that law might mean they need to break it, but it's not a zero-knowledge service so the issue doesn't arise. You're going to be hard pressed to find a service provider which ignores valid warrants. Such a service provider would need to either operate unlawfully, or not hold the information (ie be zero-knowledge). Even Protonmail, the bastion of email privacy, has supplied the IP address of a user in the face of a warrant.[0] [0] https://techcrunch.com/2021/09/06/protonmail-logged-ip-address-of-french-activist-after-order-by-swiss-authorities/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/09/06/protonmail-logged-ip-addre...
sascha_sl 5y ago
You are never safe from these shenanigans, not in Switzerland and not in Germany. If you absolutely must have email out of the hands of low to mid grade government entities you need to implement the technical solutions yourself. If you want more, just forget it, if they want your mail they'll just get it at your endpoint anyway. (also, "most email is unencrypted in transit" is a very out of date take, I've checked all correspondence I've had with medical practicioners in the past 2 years, and all where at least TLS 1.2 on the transport, close to half 1.3 - and i was sent around quite a lot last year)
- kyboren 5y ago
  > If you absolutely must have email out of the hands of low to mid grade government entities you need to implement the technical solutions yourself. Very off-topic, but this is exactly the most important and consistently underappreciated angle to the Hillary Clinton email server scandal. She deliberately designed her team's communications infrastructure to be maximally resistant to legal process. I don't want to make this political, it just bugs me that media coverage--regardless of political slant--always seems focused on irrelevant details and ignores what (arguably) makes it an actual scandal.
exolymph 5y ago
I'm not expecting government-resistance from any third-party service.

by miles 5y ago

YPPH 5y ago

Fastmail is not a zero-knowledge service. Unless I'm missing something, anti-encryption laws seem to be irrelevant, since they don't really change the position at all. I suppose hypothetically if Fastmail was a zero-knowledge service that law might mean they need to break it, but it's not a zero-knowledge service so the issue doesn't arise. You're going to be hard pressed to find a service provider which ignores valid warrants. Such a service provider would need to either operate unlawfully, or not hold the information (ie be zero-knowledge). Even Protonmail, the bastion of email privacy, has supplied the IP address of a user in the face of a warrant.[0] [0] https://techcrunch.com/2021/09/06/protonmail-logged-ip-address-of-french-activist-after-order-by-swiss-authorities/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/09/06/protonmail-logged-ip-addre...

sascha_sl 5y ago

You are never safe from these shenanigans, not in Switzerland and not in Germany. If you absolutely must have email out of the hands of low to mid grade government entities you need to implement the technical solutions yourself. If you want more, just forget it, if they want your mail they'll just get it at your endpoint anyway. (also, "most email is unencrypted in transit" is a very out of date take, I've checked all correspondence I've had with medical practicioners in the past 2 years, and all where at least TLS 1.2 on the transport, close to half 1.3 - and i was sent around quite a lot last year)

kyboren 5y ago
> If you absolutely must have email out of the hands of low to mid grade government entities you need to implement the technical solutions yourself. Very off-topic, but this is exactly the most important and consistently underappreciated angle to the Hillary Clinton email server scandal. She deliberately designed her team's communications infrastructure to be maximally resistant to legal process. I don't want to make this political, it just bugs me that media coverage--regardless of political slant--always seems focused on irrelevant details and ignores what (arguably) makes it an actual scandal.

exolymph 5y ago

I'm not expecting government-resistance from any third-party service.