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Thich Nhat Hanh taught that just like a cloud seems to disappear from the sky, it's not really, it has simply changed form. The appearance of vanishing is just

by warent 5y ago

Thich Nhat Hanh taught that just like a cloud seems to disappear from the sky, it's not really, it has simply changed form. The appearance of vanishing is just that: an appearance. Really nothing is created or destroyed. In this way, there is no loss here, Thầy has transitioned into another phase of life. A beauty worth celebrating

markdown 5y ago
Surely it's lost to the sky, having fallen to the earth as rain? This is like one of those things people overlay on an image of a flower or a cloudy sky and then post to facebook.
- noobhacker 5y ago
  Buddhism is about recognizing that everything is one, i.e. there's no sky/earth, but just sky-earth as one thing altogether. Of course you don't have to believe it or find it useful, I'm just explaining Buddhist thought in general and Thich Nhat Hanh's thoughts in particular here.
  - markdown 5y ago
    > I'm just explaining Buddhist thought in general and Thich Nhat Hanh's thoughts in particular here. Thank you. I shouldn't have been so dismissive. Just feeling a bit cynical these days. You have a good day.
    - nerbert 5y ago
      A retreat would seem helpful :)
  - carrolldunham 5y ago
    >Buddhism is about Not sure you can say that. see e.g. https://tricycle.org/magazine/we-are-not-one/ https://tricycle.org/magazine/we-are-not-one/
  - drzaiusapelord 5y ago
    There's many flavors of Buddhism and the idea of all "being one" isn't a shared philosophy amongst them all. The "woo" and connected, anything goes mentality, etc is mostly centered on "California Buddhism," which is a sort of western bastardization of common Buddhist concepts. If you were to study, say, Theravada, you'd see something a lot more austere, less touch-feely (but compassionate), and very much centered on the four noble truths and eightfold path. It reflects a great deal about suffering, overcoming suffering in a Buddhist fashion, and living very, very morally. So it helps to name the specific brand of Buddhism you're discussing. You're saying something akin to Christians all believe in transubstantiation and see the Pope as their leader, who can declare himself infallible if he chooses. Yes, Catholics do believe this, but not other Christians. Or speaking in tongues or handling snakes. Or that Jesus was a white northern European man with blue eyes.
    - Talanes 5y ago
      Specifically the "all is one" philosophy is a western misreading of the Three Marks of Existence, so it's easy to misidentify them as the same thing if you have never been properly exposed to the latter. An egocentric culture would rather extend the ego outward, rather than fully embrace the concept of ego being illusory.
      - drzaiusapelord 5y ago
        The absurdity I like to point out sometimes (usually with a lot of downvotes when I talk about this on HN) is how capitalism corrupts nearly all. Countless employers sell their employees on the idea of "Learn meditation to help with work stress" instead of "Lets talk about by work is stressful and how we can fix that." The former just buzzword dishonesty, the latter something that could affect profits, and even if only .01% of profits spent to make workers lives 100% better it would be deemed unacceptable in capitalism. Even if the stinginess of the capital owning class could be curtailed, this reform still wouldn't be acceptable because it would be a win for workers, and keeping workers from rising up in any form is a prime feature of capitalism. Remember, the most perfect capitalist entity hires no one, pays no salaries, and only makes money for its owner. The second most perfect form uses slaves for labor. Due to a loss of a civil war, this is no longer possible here, but we certainly spilled a lot of blood trying to keep it for capitalism. Now quasi-slavery is how the game is played by making sure life's expenses keep people in line and making sure wages never get anyone independently wealthy. Some slip through but that's a bug not a feature. Of course capitalism can't exist without the ego. Everyone here is, as they say, a temporary embarrassed millionaire. Everyone believes in the CEO as this force of nature who does all sorts of things, because the CEO is crafty enough to steal credit from his underlings as self-marketing. Characters like John Galt are seen as realistic and people defend Rand's writing with a straight face. Capitalism is the ego's playground so of course, Buddhism translated here is littered with narratives that protect capitalism. I also find it a little amusing at how casually we recommend meditation as a self-help tool for workers to be more productive. If done correctly, it should do the opposite. Also this excellent piece explaining how the Pali canon refutes California Buddhism's "we are all one" belief: https://tricycle.org/magazine/we-are-not-one/ https://tricycle.org/magazine/we-are-not-one/
- vageli 5y ago
  > Surely it's lost to the sky, having fallen to the earth as rain? > This is like one of those things people overlay on an image of a flower or a cloudy sky and then post to facebook. But the substance of the cloud is not lost, just transmuted.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- SamBam 5y ago
  It's extremely easy to sneer at Buddhist teachings because they sound corny, it doesn't make a person smarter to do so.
CamperBob2 5y ago
That makes me wonder if Zen Buddhism includes an acknowledgement, either explicit or implicit, of entropy.
- bananamerica 5y ago
  Yes.
- lioeters 5y ago
  "Impermanence" is an essential teaching of Buddhism, which I'd say expresses a similar concept as entropy. > All temporal things, whether material or mental, are compounded objects in a continuous change of condition, subject to decline and destruction. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impermanence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impermanence > Impermanence (Pali anicca, Sanskrit anitya) means that all things (saṅkhāra) are in a constant state of flux. Buddhism states that all physical and mental events come into being and dissolve. > Human life embodies this flux in the aging process and the cycle of repeated birth and death (Samsara); nothing lasts, and everything decays. This is applicable to all beings and their environs, including beings who are reborn in deva (god) and naraka (hell) realms. This is in contrast to nirvana, the reality that is nicca, or knows no change, decay or death. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_marks_of_existence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_marks_of_existence
dqpb 5y ago
> Really nothing is created or destroyed Information is created and can be destroyed.
- warent 5y ago
  Not that it matters much either way, but do you have a citation for that? Basic thermodynamics means information is preserved.
- 16012022 5y ago

by warent 5y ago

markdown 5y ago

Surely it's lost to the sky, having fallen to the earth as rain? This is like one of those things people overlay on an image of a flower or a cloudy sky and then post to facebook.

noobhacker 5y ago
Buddhism is about recognizing that everything is one, i.e. there's no sky/earth, but just sky-earth as one thing altogether. Of course you don't have to believe it or find it useful, I'm just explaining Buddhist thought in general and Thich Nhat Hanh's thoughts in particular here.
- markdown 5y ago
  > I'm just explaining Buddhist thought in general and Thich Nhat Hanh's thoughts in particular here. Thank you. I shouldn't have been so dismissive. Just feeling a bit cynical these days. You have a good day.
  - nerbert 5y ago
    A retreat would seem helpful :)
- carrolldunham 5y ago
  >Buddhism is about Not sure you can say that. see e.g. https://tricycle.org/magazine/we-are-not-one/ https://tricycle.org/magazine/we-are-not-one/
- drzaiusapelord 5y ago
  There's many flavors of Buddhism and the idea of all "being one" isn't a shared philosophy amongst them all. The "woo" and connected, anything goes mentality, etc is mostly centered on "California Buddhism," which is a sort of western bastardization of common Buddhist concepts. If you were to study, say, Theravada, you'd see something a lot more austere, less touch-feely (but compassionate), and very much centered on the four noble truths and eightfold path. It reflects a great deal about suffering, overcoming suffering in a Buddhist fashion, and living very, very morally. So it helps to name the specific brand of Buddhism you're discussing. You're saying something akin to Christians all believe in transubstantiation and see the Pope as their leader, who can declare himself infallible if he chooses. Yes, Catholics do believe this, but not other Christians. Or speaking in tongues or handling snakes. Or that Jesus was a white northern European man with blue eyes.
  - Talanes 5y ago
    Specifically the "all is one" philosophy is a western misreading of the Three Marks of Existence, so it's easy to misidentify them as the same thing if you have never been properly exposed to the latter. An egocentric culture would rather extend the ego outward, rather than fully embrace the concept of ego being illusory.
    - drzaiusapelord 5y ago
      The absurdity I like to point out sometimes (usually with a lot of downvotes when I talk about this on HN) is how capitalism corrupts nearly all. Countless employers sell their employees on the idea of "Learn meditation to help with work stress" instead of "Lets talk about by work is stressful and how we can fix that." The former just buzzword dishonesty, the latter something that could affect profits, and even if only .01% of profits spent to make workers lives 100% better it would be deemed unacceptable in capitalism. Even if the stinginess of the capital owning class could be curtailed, this reform still wouldn't be acceptable because it would be a win for workers, and keeping workers from rising up in any form is a prime feature of capitalism. Remember, the most perfect capitalist entity hires no one, pays no salaries, and only makes money for its owner. The second most perfect form uses slaves for labor. Due to a loss of a civil war, this is no longer possible here, but we certainly spilled a lot of blood trying to keep it for capitalism. Now quasi-slavery is how the game is played by making sure life's expenses keep people in line and making sure wages never get anyone independently wealthy. Some slip through but that's a bug not a feature. Of course capitalism can't exist without the ego. Everyone here is, as they say, a temporary embarrassed millionaire. Everyone believes in the CEO as this force of nature who does all sorts of things, because the CEO is crafty enough to steal credit from his underlings as self-marketing. Characters like John Galt are seen as realistic and people defend Rand's writing with a straight face. Capitalism is the ego's playground so of course, Buddhism translated here is littered with narratives that protect capitalism. I also find it a little amusing at how casually we recommend meditation as a self-help tool for workers to be more productive. If done correctly, it should do the opposite. Also this excellent piece explaining how the Pali canon refutes California Buddhism's "we are all one" belief: https://tricycle.org/magazine/we-are-not-one/ https://tricycle.org/magazine/we-are-not-one/
vageli 5y ago
> Surely it's lost to the sky, having fallen to the earth as rain? > This is like one of those things people overlay on an image of a flower or a cloudy sky and then post to facebook. But the substance of the cloud is not lost, just transmuted.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
SamBam 5y ago
It's extremely easy to sneer at Buddhist teachings because they sound corny, it doesn't make a person smarter to do so.

CamperBob2 5y ago

That makes me wonder if Zen Buddhism includes an acknowledgement, either explicit or implicit, of entropy.

bananamerica 5y ago
Yes.
lioeters 5y ago
"Impermanence" is an essential teaching of Buddhism, which I'd say expresses a similar concept as entropy. > All temporal things, whether material or mental, are compounded objects in a continuous change of condition, subject to decline and destruction. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impermanence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impermanence > Impermanence (Pali anicca, Sanskrit anitya) means that all things (saṅkhāra) are in a constant state of flux. Buddhism states that all physical and mental events come into being and dissolve. > Human life embodies this flux in the aging process and the cycle of repeated birth and death (Samsara); nothing lasts, and everything decays. This is applicable to all beings and their environs, including beings who are reborn in deva (god) and naraka (hell) realms. This is in contrast to nirvana, the reality that is nicca, or knows no change, decay or death. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_marks_of_existence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_marks_of_existence

dqpb 5y ago

> Really nothing is created or destroyed Information is created and can be destroyed.

warent 5y ago
Not that it matters much either way, but do you have a citation for that? Basic thermodynamics means information is preserved.
16012022 5y ago