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A question for you all: I've seen the Derren Brown video[1] mentioned at the beginning of this article. But I'm wondering whether it is "real". For example, th

A question for you all: I've seen the Derren Brown video[1] mentioned at the beginning of this article. But I'm wondering whether it is "real". For example, there must be a cameraman in the car on the trip, and he deliberately films the supposed subliminal cues. Are we expected to believe that the people in the car did not notice this? And there are other carefully positioned cameramen on the route the car takes. Etc. I think it likely that the video is a setup -- or at least a very poorly designed experiment. I realize that this article is really about Whole Foods and their marketing strategy. Still, the article spends three paragraphs talking about Brown's "trick", implying that it is solid evidence of an surprising and significant phenomenon. And now the question: What you do think? Also, does anyone have more concrete evidence on trustworthiness of the Brown video? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyQjr1YL0zg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyQjr1YL0zg

tzs 15y ago
I didn't see any shots where the cameraman suspiciously dwelled on the cues during the ride. They were mostly caught in passing during pans, or in the background when the camera was ostensibly filming the ad guys on the ride. I don't see why you think the cameramen along the route would arouse suspicion. This wasn't an undercover operation where the ad guys didn't know up front they were being filmed for a TV segment. The only secret part would be that they were the subject of the experiment rather than part of the set up for an experiment on some other subject.
duopixel 15y ago
Assuming the episode was completely real, I'd argue that he set up a creative problem that had only one posible solution. Ask any creative professional how he would make taxidermy tasteful for the general public and he will likely have to recur to heaven, as death has no other upside. Heaven, being an abstract concept, only has a couple of physical references: gates, angels, clouds. And if an eight foot bear is subliminal priming, I'll be damned.
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parkov 15y ago
Quite likely a setup and not some psychological effect. He's relied on similar tricks in the past, such as using video effects to "predict" the lottery [1] and a fake casino set under the pretense of calculating the trajectory of a roulette ball [2]. [1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG-5qebwflA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG-5qebwflA See drdirs's comment. [2] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVThCpMPON0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVThCpMPON0 See mazotu's comment.
Despite 15y ago
Unfortunately, I can't offer anything specific to that video. But I can say that many of Derren's tricks are combinations of forces, multiple tries (how many ad execs participated?), compliant participants, and my favorite "dual realities". Dual realities are when a magician's words have different meanings, depending on how people have been prepped. And with video, you don't know what sort of direct priming he cut out. In general, I've come to believe that the explanations he offers are NEVER the real mechanism for the trick. The pseudo-explanation. The wonderment that the given explanation might possibly work just adds to the trick.
shaggyfrog 15y ago
From what I've seen and read about Derren Brown, I think he likes this kind of skepticism about what he does. That was basically the whole premise of the "win the lottery" video, for example... to show how easy it is for people to be bamboozled.
huhtenberg 15y ago
I think it's a fake. The whole priming process was based on the assumption that creative execs will stare out taxi window during the ride. And that is a very large assumption. I basically do not know anyone who would do that unless they are lost in their thoughts in which case they won't even focus, optically, on anything outside of the car. So, yeah, fake I would say. Nice idea though.
aptwebapps 15y ago
I believe this is the actual video mentioned in the article. It's the American version. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f29kF1vZ62o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f29kF1vZ62o

tzs 15y ago

I didn't see any shots where the cameraman suspiciously dwelled on the cues during the ride. They were mostly caught in passing during pans, or in the background when the camera was ostensibly filming the ad guys on the ride. I don't see why you think the cameramen along the route would arouse suspicion. This wasn't an undercover operation where the ad guys didn't know up front they were being filmed for a TV segment. The only secret part would be that they were the subject of the experiment rather than part of the set up for an experiment on some other subject.

duopixel 15y ago

Assuming the episode was completely real, I'd argue that he set up a creative problem that had only one posible solution. Ask any creative professional how he would make taxidermy tasteful for the general public and he will likely have to recur to heaven, as death has no other upside. Heaven, being an abstract concept, only has a couple of physical references: gates, angels, clouds. And if an eight foot bear is subliminal priming, I'll be damned.

deleted 15y ago
[deleted]

parkov 15y ago

Quite likely a setup and not some psychological effect. He's relied on similar tricks in the past, such as using video effects to "predict" the lottery [1] and a fake casino set under the pretense of calculating the trajectory of a roulette ball [2]. [1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG-5qebwflA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG-5qebwflA See drdirs's comment. [2] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVThCpMPON0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVThCpMPON0 See mazotu's comment.

Despite 15y ago

Unfortunately, I can't offer anything specific to that video. But I can say that many of Derren's tricks are combinations of forces, multiple tries (how many ad execs participated?), compliant participants, and my favorite "dual realities". Dual realities are when a magician's words have different meanings, depending on how people have been prepped. And with video, you don't know what sort of direct priming he cut out. In general, I've come to believe that the explanations he offers are NEVER the real mechanism for the trick. The pseudo-explanation. The wonderment that the given explanation might possibly work just adds to the trick.

shaggyfrog 15y ago

From what I've seen and read about Derren Brown, I think he likes this kind of skepticism about what he does. That was basically the whole premise of the "win the lottery" video, for example... to show how easy it is for people to be bamboozled.

huhtenberg 15y ago

I think it's a fake. The whole priming process was based on the assumption that creative execs will stare out taxi window during the ride. And that is a very large assumption. I basically do not know anyone who would do that unless they are lost in their thoughts in which case they won't even focus, optically, on anything outside of the car. So, yeah, fake I would say. Nice idea though.

aptwebapps 15y ago

I believe this is the actual video mentioned in the article. It's the American version. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f29kF1vZ62o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f29kF1vZ62o