4 ms·

But you're now getting the worst of both worlds. It was not uncommon back in the day you could buy a copy of the software which was bundled with the source code

But you're now getting the worst of both worlds. It was not uncommon back in the day you could buy a copy of the software which was bundled with the source code. Now you have to pay and you don't have the source code. You're just trapped into an ecosystem you have no control over. I of course understand your point that software developers need to pay rent, but i'm interested in exploring other possibilities, such as non-profits gathering donations to pay for development/UX (like framasoft does). Now, the same problem applies to all kinds of workers, from bakers to carpenters. If we take a look at the wider picture, why would anyone have to pay for rent and food? Wouldn't we all be better off if we did what we loved and shared unappreciated tasks more equally so that money doesn't get involved? It seems like we have a "these people are not getting paid enough to pay for basic survival while doing their critical job" discussion every other week.

porcoda 5y ago
Seriously? Since when could you buy COTS and expect to get the code too? I don’t remember a source archive accompanying the pre-subscription Adobe, Microsoft, or any other major piece of software that is now subscription-ware. That’s pure fantasy.
- joshuaissac 5y ago
  > Since when could you buy COTS and expect to get the code too? Since the 1950s and 1960s. IBM, for example, provided source code for their products until 1983.[1] The full Apple II source code was included in the Apple II Reference Manual;[2] similarly for the Atari 400/800 Technical Reference Notes.[3] 1. https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=hSBrPSYgjI4C&redir_esc=y https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=hSBrPSYgjI4C&redir_esc=y (page 59) 2. https://archive.org/details/applerefjan78/page/n78/mode/2up https://archive.org/details/applerefjan78/page/n78/mode/2up 3. https://archive.org/details/CO16555AtariHomeComputerTechnicalReferenceNotes1982/page/n259/mode/2up https://archive.org/details/CO16555AtariHomeComputerTechnica...
  - broeng 5y ago
    But back then, you were rarely paying for the software directly, you were paying for hardware.
  - ndiddy 5y ago
    If anyone is curious what happened in 1983, that’s the same year that Apple Computer Inc. v. Franklin Computer Corp. set the precedent that binary data is covered by copyright (before this case, only source code was covered).
    - doctor_eval 5y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Computer%2C_Inc._v._Franklin_Computer_Corp https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Computer%2C_Inc._v._Fran....
- ponow 5y ago
  I vaguely recall that you could get source code back in the 70s and early 80s, with early UNIX say or mainframe code, because the revenue was from the big machines. Technical reference manuals for the early IBM PC were awesome.

porcoda 5y ago

Seriously? Since when could you buy COTS and expect to get the code too? I don’t remember a source archive accompanying the pre-subscription Adobe, Microsoft, or any other major piece of software that is now subscription-ware. That’s pure fantasy.

joshuaissac 5y ago
> Since when could you buy COTS and expect to get the code too? Since the 1950s and 1960s. IBM, for example, provided source code for their products until 1983.[1] The full Apple II source code was included in the Apple II Reference Manual;[2] similarly for the Atari 400/800 Technical Reference Notes.[3] 1. https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=hSBrPSYgjI4C&redir_esc=y https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=hSBrPSYgjI4C&redir_esc=y (page 59) 2. https://archive.org/details/applerefjan78/page/n78/mode/2up https://archive.org/details/applerefjan78/page/n78/mode/2up 3. https://archive.org/details/CO16555AtariHomeComputerTechnicalReferenceNotes1982/page/n259/mode/2up https://archive.org/details/CO16555AtariHomeComputerTechnica...
- broeng 5y ago
  But back then, you were rarely paying for the software directly, you were paying for hardware.
- ndiddy 5y ago
  If anyone is curious what happened in 1983, that’s the same year that Apple Computer Inc. v. Franklin Computer Corp. set the precedent that binary data is covered by copyright (before this case, only source code was covered).
  - doctor_eval 5y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Computer%2C_Inc._v._Franklin_Computer_Corp https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Computer%2C_Inc._v._Fran....
ponow 5y ago
I vaguely recall that you could get source code back in the 70s and early 80s, with early UNIX say or mainframe code, because the revenue was from the big machines. Technical reference manuals for the early IBM PC were awesome.