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So be it! Until XyZ is the new WebAssembly and @!# is the new XyZ! As long as my Django backend works and browsers support my HTML/CSS/JS frontend, I am fine.

So be it! Until XyZ is the new WebAssembly and @!# is the new XyZ! As long as my Django backend works and browsers support my HTML/CSS/JS frontend, I am fine. I have the same LAMP (Linux, Apache, MariaDB, Python) SAAS project running for decades now, paying all my bills, letting me live a free life. As long as nobody touches that, you can do all you want. Invent new fancy stacks every other year, make courses for it, migrations to it, a religion of it - I don't mind.

aenario 5y ago
I think your LAMP (Linux, Apache, MariaDB, Python) is a fancy new LAMP (Linux, Apache, MySQL, PHP).
stavros 5y ago
Having been wrangling with a monster Nuxt.js front-end that takes 30 minutes to compile for what is essentially a few pages of an eshop, I long for it to be reimplemented in Django. SPAs are good for some things, but those things are much fewer than what we use them for.
- jack_riminton 5y ago
  I really hope this use of SPAs for CRUD apps like eshops is going to end soon, it's completely unhinged. There's a reason why Shopify went with Rails
  - chrisweekly 5y ago
    Agreed -- but going back to Rails isn't the answer. Remix.run is moving things forward in the right way, ie PHP/Rails -> SPA -> NextJS -> Remix.
    - jack_riminton 5y ago
      It sure does sound like the latest "next best thing"! I'll stick to Rails though thanks :)
    - slingnow 5y ago
      Wow, that sounds like such a simple process! It's definitely the "right way"! Never look back at working tech folks. That's today's lesson. If it works, don't just fix it -- remake it, rebrand it, and overcomplicate it!
      - chrisweekly 5y ago
        If you spent 3 minutes reading https://remix.run https://remix.run you might realize that mean-spirited sarcasm and a lazy, ignorant trope were not your best response.
samwillis 5y ago
I’m a Django developer at hart and have been for 15 years. The dream I have that I hope WASM will provide is to package any app (Python, Ruby, Rust, Go, anything!) up into a single binary file that we can deploy anywhere, on any architecture (x86, arm). No more packaging nightmare, no more containers, just a single file that runs anywhere. Maybe it’s wishful thinking but I hope it happens.
- rich_sasha 5y ago
  Isn’t this basically JVM? Jython is a thing.
  - samwillis 5y ago
    The parallels between WASM and the JVM are well known. But I like to think of it as WASM is building upon the knowledge gained from the JVM. With the JVM you had to reimplement your language to target it, or design a new one. WASM was planned from the start to be a target for existing compiler frameworks such as LLVM and GCC. With Jython you could not use extensions that were designed for CPython. With WASM you can. Take a look at Pyodide, they have ported most of the scientific Python stack to WASM, that’s not possible with Jython. https://github.com/pyodide/pyodide https://github.com/pyodide/pyodide
    - pjmlp 5y ago
      Just like IBM TIMI, TenDra, Amsterdam Compiler Toolkit, CLI. That is the thing with WebAssembly marketing, not being aware of bytecode formats history.
    - immibis 5y ago
      And yet WASM still has warts that make it impossible to simply transpile existing binary code onto it. Java, by the way, also isn't stopping you from storing all your data in one big ByteBuffer, which is how WASM handles memory.
  - pjc50 5y ago
    Sort of - and the JVM has been a thing on webservers since WebSphere and Tomcat. But never quite achieved the ease of use. I'm not aware of a service you can just chuck a jar at and your webservice spins up on your (sub) domain? Jython has been a casualty of the 2 => 3 transition.
pjmlp 5y ago
Same here, it is kind of funny to see Java and .NET being re-invented by haters all the time. First they do containers to replicate application servers, and now WASM to replicate bytecode server side.
- tormeh 5y ago
  The JVM is actually good, but it is a bit too Java-centric. A VM without GC and with a more economic memory model is needed, and it looks like wasm is that.
- ptrwis 5y ago
  And were these application servers (like JavaEE) that bad? Separately deployed EJB modules can also be considered microservices, and everything was much easier to manage.
  - pjmlp 5y ago
    Not at all, I am still working with modern versions of them. In fact I consider Kubernetes much worse experience, regardless of how much hate Websphere and Co might get.
chrisandchris 5y ago
If WebAssembly is the new k8s (in terms of complexity), I am going to do as much as with k8s with it: nothing.
ridiculous_leke 5y ago
Off topic: I assume you have your own SaaS app. If yes, can you share more details about it?

aenario 5y ago

I think your LAMP (Linux, Apache, MariaDB, Python) is a fancy new LAMP (Linux, Apache, MySQL, PHP).

stavros 5y ago

Having been wrangling with a monster Nuxt.js front-end that takes 30 minutes to compile for what is essentially a few pages of an eshop, I long for it to be reimplemented in Django. SPAs are good for some things, but those things are much fewer than what we use them for.

jack_riminton 5y ago
I really hope this use of SPAs for CRUD apps like eshops is going to end soon, it's completely unhinged. There's a reason why Shopify went with Rails
- chrisweekly 5y ago
  Agreed -- but going back to Rails isn't the answer. Remix.run is moving things forward in the right way, ie PHP/Rails -> SPA -> NextJS -> Remix.
  - jack_riminton 5y ago
    It sure does sound like the latest "next best thing"! I'll stick to Rails though thanks :)
  - slingnow 5y ago
    Wow, that sounds like such a simple process! It's definitely the "right way"! Never look back at working tech folks. That's today's lesson. If it works, don't just fix it -- remake it, rebrand it, and overcomplicate it!
    - chrisweekly 5y ago
      If you spent 3 minutes reading https://remix.run https://remix.run you might realize that mean-spirited sarcasm and a lazy, ignorant trope were not your best response.

samwillis 5y ago

I’m a Django developer at hart and have been for 15 years. The dream I have that I hope WASM will provide is to package any app (Python, Ruby, Rust, Go, anything!) up into a single binary file that we can deploy anywhere, on any architecture (x86, arm). No more packaging nightmare, no more containers, just a single file that runs anywhere. Maybe it’s wishful thinking but I hope it happens.

rich_sasha 5y ago
Isn’t this basically JVM? Jython is a thing.
- samwillis 5y ago
  The parallels between WASM and the JVM are well known. But I like to think of it as WASM is building upon the knowledge gained from the JVM. With the JVM you had to reimplement your language to target it, or design a new one. WASM was planned from the start to be a target for existing compiler frameworks such as LLVM and GCC. With Jython you could not use extensions that were designed for CPython. With WASM you can. Take a look at Pyodide, they have ported most of the scientific Python stack to WASM, that’s not possible with Jython. https://github.com/pyodide/pyodide https://github.com/pyodide/pyodide
  - pjmlp 5y ago
    Just like IBM TIMI, TenDra, Amsterdam Compiler Toolkit, CLI. That is the thing with WebAssembly marketing, not being aware of bytecode formats history.
  - immibis 5y ago
    And yet WASM still has warts that make it impossible to simply transpile existing binary code onto it. Java, by the way, also isn't stopping you from storing all your data in one big ByteBuffer, which is how WASM handles memory.
- pjc50 5y ago
  Sort of - and the JVM has been a thing on webservers since WebSphere and Tomcat. But never quite achieved the ease of use. I'm not aware of a service you can just chuck a jar at and your webservice spins up on your (sub) domain? Jython has been a casualty of the 2 => 3 transition.

pjmlp 5y ago

Same here, it is kind of funny to see Java and .NET being re-invented by haters all the time. First they do containers to replicate application servers, and now WASM to replicate bytecode server side.

tormeh 5y ago
The JVM is actually good, but it is a bit too Java-centric. A VM without GC and with a more economic memory model is needed, and it looks like wasm is that.
ptrwis 5y ago
And were these application servers (like JavaEE) that bad? Separately deployed EJB modules can also be considered microservices, and everything was much easier to manage.
- pjmlp 5y ago
  Not at all, I am still working with modern versions of them. In fact I consider Kubernetes much worse experience, regardless of how much hate Websphere and Co might get.

chrisandchris 5y ago

If WebAssembly is the new k8s (in terms of complexity), I am going to do as much as with k8s with it: nothing.

ridiculous_leke 5y ago

Off topic: I assume you have your own SaaS app. If yes, can you share more details about it?