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Terrific story. Personal, authentic, and very relatable. Interest in and an aptitude for computers also saved me. (I even had a job in a computer store.) > I m

Terrific story. Personal, authentic, and very relatable. Interest in and an aptitude for computers also saved me. (I even had a job in a computer store.) > I made the cold calculation that as painful as my life was, it was probably better than rolling the dice with the child protection services. Yup. I too decided at age 11, choosing to live with the less bad parent. And shortly thereafter, those decisions were made for me, resulting in the state putting me into foster care. Somehow I avoided the worst; while the 1st family was pretty much what you'd expect, I later lucked into a good family. -- I wonder how many of us there are. I've known so many runaways, beaten kids, sexually abused kids, kids with broken parents. And that's just in my wealthy, prosperous city. I can't imagine how much worse it is every where else. I also marvel that somehow some of us find a way out, while seemingly most others get sucked into the abyss. So much human potential lost due to poor circumstances and stupid luck. It fills me with deep sadness. And I wonder what the difference is. How are some able to escape their fate? If we can identify those success factors, maybe we can maximize chances for success. Could even be small measures, like how we now have suicide prevention hotlines, and resources for victims of human trafficking. -- I had many, many people help me over the years. People who had no reason to help, but did nonetheless. I call them my angels. People like a little league coach (who'd drive me to practice), a youth pastor (who mentored me), the foster family that raised me, etc, etc. As society becomes harsher, more coarse, more dog-eat-dog, I worry that other lost kids won't have their own angels.

indigochill 5y ago
> If we can identify those success factors I don't have complete answers, but my capstone project in college involved interviewing a handful of people who volunteered in their communities to see if we could come up with some hypotheses about hooks to get more people to engage with their local communities. My takeaway from the interviews was that people's reasons for volunteering were essentially intrinsic, not extrinsic. One guy had benefited from books donated to his prison so felt he should pay it forward after he was out. A mom volunteered in activities her kids were engaging in. Someone else volunteered as a way of staying socially active. There _were_ clear motivations, but not something you'd likely have much luck leveraging en masse without knowing someone's history and what they personally cared about. However, you can maybe approach the problem preemptively by creating an environment that creates the sorts of people who will give back to their community (maybe being a good foster parent to a kid who decides it's important to be a good faster parent to someone else). It's not fool proof - even good parents can see their kids go bad - but it's a start.
- Consultant32452 5y ago
  I don't believe communities will bond together as long as the state provides a fake feeling of social security (lower case). The state came in and declared itself the entity you turn to when times are tough: you lost your job, became disabled/sick, need daycare/schooling for your kids, etc. Now, instead of having relationships with your community, you have a relationship with the state. With the modern design of communities with powerful governments, you will only find small pockets where people have chosen to come together for some higher purpose like religious communities. And yes of course small/random exceptions to these rules will exist, but this is how it works at scale.
  - EricE 5y ago
    Exactly. Centralizing resources at the state level - whether it's financial, social or whatever - removes the biggest success factor: what's in it for me? A lot of people tend to look at that phrase cynically. I tend to be more pragmatic - no one is going to care about my needs more than I am. And if I go the 100% selfish path then no one else is going to want to interact with me, so it's in my self interest to NOT be a jerk - self governing. Start to break down those personal interdependencies (and remove some of those self governing mechanisms at the same time too) by inserting shortcuts around them - like substituting resources from government - and you start to see things break down. Just look at the effects of welfare on minority communities. Disincentives for young women from getting married and you have generations of kids, especially young males, without the influence of a father - and the results of that are pretty apparent. As others point out, even crappy parents are often way better than the alternatives. The middle class of the black community in particular was rapidly expanding post WWII - until the "great society" welfare programs kicked in, with pretty devastating results - to them, anyway. It was a boon for politicians who now had power over an ever growing and dependent base.
    - erosenbe0 5y ago
      Your romanticization of post WWII conditions is highly inaccurate. Black middle class expanded because of migration insofar as segregation and maltreatment allowed. Take Silicon Valley. Segregation was legal and often preferred there until 1964 so the growing Black middle class was systematically denied entry in the 1950s to the growing job potential there. How many Blacks worked at HP in 1960s, or Intel in 1970s? How many Blacks worked at a mechanic shop or a cleaning service or a coffee place or any auxiliary business in Silicon Valley in the post WWII era, so their children could gain a foothold in the schools and the massive wealth creation engine? How many Black dental hygienists were there in Santa Clara county? Secretaries? Schoolteachers? Firefighters? How many Black friends did Steve Jobs have in grade school in the 1960s?
Mezzie 5y ago
> I too decided at age 11, choosing to live with the less bad parent. I chose this at 13, but due to his new spouse and her opinions about proper gendered behavior, it meant I had to move and lost all the adults who were supporting my programming. I was supposed to like clothes, make-up, and have feminine hobbies, so no more electronics gifts and no more access to the classes and meetings that the larger community had. (I moved from a metro area of 500k to a town of 2k). I still worry if it would have been better for my career to stay and accept the greater abuse, which is fucked up. Am I deflecting responsibility and blaming others for my own failures? Etc. > As society becomes harsher, more coarse, more dog-eat-dog, I worry that other lost kids won't have their own angels. I'm hoping I can be one. I'm trying to be a good adult, and I want to work with foster teens eventually.
- wbsss4412 5y ago
  > I still worry if it would have been better for my career to stay and accept the greater abuse, which is fucked up. Am I deflecting responsibility and blaming others for my own failures? Etc. Wondering if growing up in a more supportive environment would have helped you advance more quickly is a perfectly reasonable question, that’s not “blaming others for your failures”. Don’t be so hard on yourself, it sounds like you were placed into a very difficult set of circumstances.
- specialist 5y ago
  That's amazing. I'm so glad you survived. > Am I deflecting responsibility and blaming others for my own failures? No. You were forced to make a decision. You did the best you could. You did not fail. You survived. You're still here. Fighting. Trying to become the person you were always meant to be. Doubt, rumination, self-examination can all be helpful. Those of us without good role models have to work harder to figure out which way is up. I only encourage you to not dwell too long on the past. Like I've done. There's only such much juice to squeeze from those turnips. After a time, you'll be better served by looking forward.
devwastaken 5y ago
A friend whom has since passed at their choice was in the system since birth. Computers and online friends was all he had even as an adult at 21. Most of it through FPS PC games with large battlegrounds and player communities. His high school kicked him out after enough times reformatting the school laptop so he could do what he wanted. No one to advocate for him. No chance any uni would accept him, and too far away from a community college. Plus this is when everything was mostly still pencil paper. He was a good man in the wrong place with the wrong support, and I miss him.

indigochill 5y ago

> If we can identify those success factors I don't have complete answers, but my capstone project in college involved interviewing a handful of people who volunteered in their communities to see if we could come up with some hypotheses about hooks to get more people to engage with their local communities. My takeaway from the interviews was that people's reasons for volunteering were essentially intrinsic, not extrinsic. One guy had benefited from books donated to his prison so felt he should pay it forward after he was out. A mom volunteered in activities her kids were engaging in. Someone else volunteered as a way of staying socially active. There _were_ clear motivations, but not something you'd likely have much luck leveraging en masse without knowing someone's history and what they personally cared about. However, you can maybe approach the problem preemptively by creating an environment that creates the sorts of people who will give back to their community (maybe being a good foster parent to a kid who decides it's important to be a good faster parent to someone else). It's not fool proof - even good parents can see their kids go bad - but it's a start.

Consultant32452 5y ago
I don't believe communities will bond together as long as the state provides a fake feeling of social security (lower case). The state came in and declared itself the entity you turn to when times are tough: you lost your job, became disabled/sick, need daycare/schooling for your kids, etc. Now, instead of having relationships with your community, you have a relationship with the state. With the modern design of communities with powerful governments, you will only find small pockets where people have chosen to come together for some higher purpose like religious communities. And yes of course small/random exceptions to these rules will exist, but this is how it works at scale.
- EricE 5y ago
  Exactly. Centralizing resources at the state level - whether it's financial, social or whatever - removes the biggest success factor: what's in it for me? A lot of people tend to look at that phrase cynically. I tend to be more pragmatic - no one is going to care about my needs more than I am. And if I go the 100% selfish path then no one else is going to want to interact with me, so it's in my self interest to NOT be a jerk - self governing. Start to break down those personal interdependencies (and remove some of those self governing mechanisms at the same time too) by inserting shortcuts around them - like substituting resources from government - and you start to see things break down. Just look at the effects of welfare on minority communities. Disincentives for young women from getting married and you have generations of kids, especially young males, without the influence of a father - and the results of that are pretty apparent. As others point out, even crappy parents are often way better than the alternatives. The middle class of the black community in particular was rapidly expanding post WWII - until the "great society" welfare programs kicked in, with pretty devastating results - to them, anyway. It was a boon for politicians who now had power over an ever growing and dependent base.
  - erosenbe0 5y ago
    Your romanticization of post WWII conditions is highly inaccurate. Black middle class expanded because of migration insofar as segregation and maltreatment allowed. Take Silicon Valley. Segregation was legal and often preferred there until 1964 so the growing Black middle class was systematically denied entry in the 1950s to the growing job potential there. How many Blacks worked at HP in 1960s, or Intel in 1970s? How many Blacks worked at a mechanic shop or a cleaning service or a coffee place or any auxiliary business in Silicon Valley in the post WWII era, so their children could gain a foothold in the schools and the massive wealth creation engine? How many Black dental hygienists were there in Santa Clara county? Secretaries? Schoolteachers? Firefighters? How many Black friends did Steve Jobs have in grade school in the 1960s?

Mezzie 5y ago

> I too decided at age 11, choosing to live with the less bad parent. I chose this at 13, but due to his new spouse and her opinions about proper gendered behavior, it meant I had to move and lost all the adults who were supporting my programming. I was supposed to like clothes, make-up, and have feminine hobbies, so no more electronics gifts and no more access to the classes and meetings that the larger community had. (I moved from a metro area of 500k to a town of 2k). I still worry if it would have been better for my career to stay and accept the greater abuse, which is fucked up. Am I deflecting responsibility and blaming others for my own failures? Etc. > As society becomes harsher, more coarse, more dog-eat-dog, I worry that other lost kids won't have their own angels. I'm hoping I can be one. I'm trying to be a good adult, and I want to work with foster teens eventually.

wbsss4412 5y ago
> I still worry if it would have been better for my career to stay and accept the greater abuse, which is fucked up. Am I deflecting responsibility and blaming others for my own failures? Etc. Wondering if growing up in a more supportive environment would have helped you advance more quickly is a perfectly reasonable question, that’s not “blaming others for your failures”. Don’t be so hard on yourself, it sounds like you were placed into a very difficult set of circumstances.
specialist 5y ago
That's amazing. I'm so glad you survived. > Am I deflecting responsibility and blaming others for my own failures? No. You were forced to make a decision. You did the best you could. You did not fail. You survived. You're still here. Fighting. Trying to become the person you were always meant to be. Doubt, rumination, self-examination can all be helpful. Those of us without good role models have to work harder to figure out which way is up. I only encourage you to not dwell too long on the past. Like I've done. There's only such much juice to squeeze from those turnips. After a time, you'll be better served by looking forward.

devwastaken 5y ago

A friend whom has since passed at their choice was in the system since birth. Computers and online friends was all he had even as an adult at 21. Most of it through FPS PC games with large battlegrounds and player communities. His high school kicked him out after enough times reformatting the school laptop so he could do what he wanted. No one to advocate for him. No chance any uni would accept him, and too far away from a community college. Plus this is when everything was mostly still pencil paper. He was a good man in the wrong place with the wrong support, and I miss him.