4 ms·

ok, lets go with that. What happens when the manager says "yes, implement the script and then we are going to fire you". What if Op refuses to implement the scr

ok, lets go with that. What happens when the manager says "yes, implement the script and then we are going to fire you". What if Op refuses to implement the script then and just quits? A logical employee with rational self interest would never have that conversation because they know it likely ends with their termination. So in reality your proposal actually leads to the employee never implementing or recommending the script for fear of losing their job and the employer continuing to suffer as the prior manual process leads to missed deadlines. Your suggestion can only end with a lose / lose scenario. This is a prisoners dilemma where OP is incentivized not to discuss his solution with the employer and is really his only rational option.

neom 5y ago
Fire the employee and hire someone off fiver to look at the script and explain it, and then get an intern to run it once a week. If the script isn't written, I now know I can hire a consultant to write the script once. Sounds like a win for me. Except that's not how it would play out in one of my orgs, I'd chat with the employee and find a solution, if they're not excited about ANY other work in my business at all, I'm not sure they are a good fit for my business. As big boy buffet said. Price is what you pay, but value is what you get, the terms of that deal should be pretty clear imo.
- Sohcahtoa82 5y ago
  I've read through this thread and you're doing a pretty poor job of convincing me the employee should speak up. The employee has two choices: 1. Say nothing and keep collecting a paycheck. 2. Speak up about the script and start a conversation that has the possibility of leading towards termination. It's a pretty big no-brainer for what they should do.
  - neom 5y ago
    The employee can do as they please, in fact I'm not even saying I disagree with the employee. I'm saying to call it win-win is patently false if it's being kept a secret, they cannot know it's win-win while also lie about it. Everyone else is using my comment as a way to make a dig a capitalism, fine, no problem... but as the system is structure, what the redditor said is not true, it is not necessary win win.
- wonderwonder 5y ago
  "Fire the employee and hire someone off fiver to look at the script" This is exactly why the employee is incentivized not to tell his employer. whether he voluntarily discloses how the script works or not there is a pretty good chance he loses his job as soon as he reveals its existence even if management is thrilled about it and tells him what a great job he has done. "in one of my orgs, I'd chat with the employee and find a solution" Its a law firm, what is OP going to do abandon tech and become a paralegal? Your arguments are all very much ignoring the point of how every facet of this situation incentivizes OP not to tell management and that the most likely outcome of telling them is that they lose their job while the company benefits from OP's work and slashes a 90k salary. You are ignoring that OP as a rational actor can only take 1 of 3 actions. 1. Create the script and don't tell management. This is a win / win. Company gets its documents processed on time and OP keeps his job. 2. Don't create the script. Lose / Don't Win. Documents continue to be processed behind schedule but OP keeps his job but does hours of slow manual labor. 3. OP voluntarily gives company his script. Win / Lose. Company gets their documents processed on time, and saves 90k in salary. OP loses his job. Option 1 is the only option where both parties win.
  - neom 5y ago
    I understand the situation. I take real issue with them poster taking it upon themselves to make the decision it's win win, you don't, that's fine. :) I don't not see your perspective, I do, I just don't agree they can say it's win win given the facts. Had they posted the whole thing and ended with "so I told the company and they laughed and now I get paid to do nothing, win win" I'd never have commented. I see why they can say it's a win all around, I just don't agree it truly is, in my opinion further negotiation should happen to test it, however for the reasons discussed exhaustively, that isn't advantageous so won't happen, so I don't think we can truly say it's a win-win, they are working on asymmetric information! :) re: give up and become a paralegal, no: there may very well be other scripts to be written. I'm going for a bike ride now.
    - wonderwonder 5y ago
      Fair enough, I hope you have a good ride. Appreciated the conversation. All the best.
- CRConrad 5y ago
  > Fire the employee and hire someone off fiver to look at the script and ... 1) Ah, so your step 1 was "fire the employee". (As predicted.) And you still don't get why no rational employee would start down that path? 2) Look at what script? Step zero, you will recall -- before writing the script -- was to open the discussion with the employer.

neom 5y ago

Fire the employee and hire someone off fiver to look at the script and explain it, and then get an intern to run it once a week. If the script isn't written, I now know I can hire a consultant to write the script once. Sounds like a win for me. Except that's not how it would play out in one of my orgs, I'd chat with the employee and find a solution, if they're not excited about ANY other work in my business at all, I'm not sure they are a good fit for my business. As big boy buffet said. Price is what you pay, but value is what you get, the terms of that deal should be pretty clear imo.

Sohcahtoa82 5y ago
I've read through this thread and you're doing a pretty poor job of convincing me the employee should speak up. The employee has two choices: 1. Say nothing and keep collecting a paycheck. 2. Speak up about the script and start a conversation that has the possibility of leading towards termination. It's a pretty big no-brainer for what they should do.
- neom 5y ago
  The employee can do as they please, in fact I'm not even saying I disagree with the employee. I'm saying to call it win-win is patently false if it's being kept a secret, they cannot know it's win-win while also lie about it. Everyone else is using my comment as a way to make a dig a capitalism, fine, no problem... but as the system is structure, what the redditor said is not true, it is not necessary win win.
wonderwonder 5y ago
"Fire the employee and hire someone off fiver to look at the script" This is exactly why the employee is incentivized not to tell his employer. whether he voluntarily discloses how the script works or not there is a pretty good chance he loses his job as soon as he reveals its existence even if management is thrilled about it and tells him what a great job he has done. "in one of my orgs, I'd chat with the employee and find a solution" Its a law firm, what is OP going to do abandon tech and become a paralegal? Your arguments are all very much ignoring the point of how every facet of this situation incentivizes OP not to tell management and that the most likely outcome of telling them is that they lose their job while the company benefits from OP's work and slashes a 90k salary. You are ignoring that OP as a rational actor can only take 1 of 3 actions. 1. Create the script and don't tell management. This is a win / win. Company gets its documents processed on time and OP keeps his job. 2. Don't create the script. Lose / Don't Win. Documents continue to be processed behind schedule but OP keeps his job but does hours of slow manual labor. 3. OP voluntarily gives company his script. Win / Lose. Company gets their documents processed on time, and saves 90k in salary. OP loses his job. Option 1 is the only option where both parties win.
- neom 5y ago
  I understand the situation. I take real issue with them poster taking it upon themselves to make the decision it's win win, you don't, that's fine. :) I don't not see your perspective, I do, I just don't agree they can say it's win win given the facts. Had they posted the whole thing and ended with "so I told the company and they laughed and now I get paid to do nothing, win win" I'd never have commented. I see why they can say it's a win all around, I just don't agree it truly is, in my opinion further negotiation should happen to test it, however for the reasons discussed exhaustively, that isn't advantageous so won't happen, so I don't think we can truly say it's a win-win, they are working on asymmetric information! :) re: give up and become a paralegal, no: there may very well be other scripts to be written. I'm going for a bike ride now.
  - wonderwonder 5y ago
    Fair enough, I hope you have a good ride. Appreciated the conversation. All the best.
CRConrad 5y ago
> Fire the employee and hire someone off fiver to look at the script and ... 1) Ah, so your step 1 was "fire the employee". (As predicted.) And you still don't get why no rational employee would start down that path? 2) Look at what script? Step zero, you will recall -- before writing the script -- was to open the discussion with the employer.