3 ms·

Rich don’t have a need to do petty theft. Most of these laws do target the poor and the problems of the poor, like drug abuse, petty theft, etc. Whether you lik

Rich don’t have a need to do petty theft. Most of these laws do target the poor and the problems of the poor, like drug abuse, petty theft, etc. Whether you like to believe it or not incidences of these crimes afflict the poor significantly more than a handful of middle class kleptomaniacs.

s1artibartfast 5y ago
Oh, I fully agree that the poor more commonly commit and are victims of petty theft. What I disagree with is that hunger would even be in the top 10 drivers. Greed, addiction, antisocial disposition, lack of opportunity costs, are all far more significant. The idea that your typical thief is usually trying to put bread on the table is some sort of perverted noble savage fantasy.
- chrischen 5y ago
  Hunger is probably here a proxy for "basic needs" on the hierarchy of needs. In a modern day it can be for example a cell phone, computer, or car.
  - s1artibartfast 5y ago
    So in you mental model, these train thieves have no phone or car, are seeking an honest 9-5 job, and will put their gains towards that end?
    - chrischen 5y ago
      Not everyone has to be a saint to be part of society. There are plenty of people that wouldn't be in a life of petty crime if they had better options. The fact that we have more train thieves than say any other given country is more to do with our lack of opportunities for these people than the fact that we aren't disincentivizing it enough. Plenty of places that have fewer disincentives for crime yet have less crime. Disincentives can work as a brute force method, but if there is an underlying reason why certain minorities or groups of people are inclined to what we have defined as a crime in society, then brute force methods will just push them toward alternatives, and it may not necessarily be finding a good 9-5 job as you suggest.

3 ms·

Rich don’t have a need to do petty theft. Most of these laws do target the poor and the problems of the poor, like drug abuse, petty theft, etc. Whether you lik

by chrischen 5y ago

s1artibartfast 5y ago
Oh, I fully agree that the poor more commonly commit and are victims of petty theft. What I disagree with is that hunger would even be in the top 10 drivers. Greed, addiction, antisocial disposition, lack of opportunity costs, are all far more significant. The idea that your typical thief is usually trying to put bread on the table is some sort of perverted noble savage fantasy.
- chrischen 5y ago
  Hunger is probably here a proxy for "basic needs" on the hierarchy of needs. In a modern day it can be for example a cell phone, computer, or car.
  - s1artibartfast 5y ago
    So in you mental model, these train thieves have no phone or car, are seeking an honest 9-5 job, and will put their gains towards that end?
    - chrischen 5y ago
      Not everyone has to be a saint to be part of society. There are plenty of people that wouldn't be in a life of petty crime if they had better options. The fact that we have more train thieves than say any other given country is more to do with our lack of opportunities for these people than the fact that we aren't disincentivizing it enough. Plenty of places that have fewer disincentives for crime yet have less crime. Disincentives can work as a brute force method, but if there is an underlying reason why certain minorities or groups of people are inclined to what we have defined as a crime in society, then brute force methods will just push them toward alternatives, and it may not necessarily be finding a good 9-5 job as you suggest.