4 ms·

That’s what everyone thought. They actually reported profit with game pass.

fartcannon 5y ago
Not according to Phil in Nov 2021 https://www.essentiallysports.com/esports-news-not-the-only-focus-ps-seemingly-admits-game-pass-is-not-profitable-but-neither-is-xbox-console/ https://www.essentiallysports.com/esports-news-not-the-only-... At 15 dollars per month, 18 million subscribers, that's 3.25 billion dollars. They bought Betheseda for 7.5 billion. So now they're in the hole 4.25 billion and they still have to pay to run an entire extra company.
- afjl 5y ago
  Why would you report an acquisition's cost with the operating expenses of an ancillary service? You should compare the operating expenses of Game Pass with its revenues (i.e. Game Pass subscriptions), and you should compare Bethesda's acquisition cost + operating expenses against its projected revenues (i.e. Bethesda game sales/subscriptions. Apples to apples, oranges to oranges.
  - fartcannon 5y ago
    We could do that, but that would hide the big picture. As Phil himself said, it's not yet profitable. It's a loss leader. True cost of ownership!
    - skinnymuch 5y ago
      You are trolling at this point. I know we are to assume good faith, but the way you’re writing your replies. Repeating this Phil stuff. Combining two completely different things…
      - fartcannon 5y ago
        It's all Microsoft! The only way you sustain an unprofitable loss leader is by spending money from other parts of the company. To push game pass, theyve been buying IP. What's confusing about that? To There's no need for debasing accusations.
        Talanes 5y ago
        That might all make sense if Bethesda didn't also bring them other revenue streams. I mean, Elder Scrolls Online alone brings in a completely separate subscription stream and cash shop.
        skinnymuch 5y ago
        You keep ignoring every one saying that Bethesda acquisition which was Zenimax being acquired was also bought for other things and they got other things as well.
- calsy 5y ago
  where did you get 3.25 billion? is that a years worth of subscription income? Does game pass blow up after that or something? Have subscriptions just stopped, 18 million and ..... no more growth.
  - fartcannon 5y ago
    If they keep buying stuff, they're not gonna make any money. It is thus a loss leader, as Phil indicated.
    - skinnymuch 5y ago
      Microsoft is buying stuff. Game Pass isn’t buying stuff. Microsoft makes plenty of money. Notice how any one can decide where to draw the line of what is what. Why do you keep bringing Phil up. A loss leader isn’t the same thing as a growing SaaS. You are putting words in his mouth while repeating Phil said this, said that.
      - fartcannon 5y ago
        Yes, Microsoft makes plenty of money, that's how they're able to run game pass as a loss leader. Literally the original point.
        skinnymuch 5y ago
        So then game pass doesn’t lose billions. It makes billions since Microsoft does. Using your logic of assigning expenses and profit any where
    - calsy 5y ago
      You understand those things they are buying have value right? That they are not just throwing money into the void. Investing in future growth is what businesses does in a competitive environment. If they don't keep buying stuff their service will fail and they will lose everything they had invested to that point. Thats how you don't make money.
- skinnymuch 5y ago
  Why would you count Bethesda? I don’t understand the rationale. It isn’t even like they are the same revenue stream. The article you linked does not say anything while adding up its word count. It’s common knowledge gaming companies say consoles never make a profit (except Nintendo). Game Pass is a fledgling growing SaaS. Of course sustainable is the right term. Nothing News worthy.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - fartcannon 5y ago
    It's an answer to the reply that said they were profitable. They're not. They're 'sustainable'. That's it.
    - skinnymuch 5y ago
      Even if you want to be anal about this. Phil saying the words sustainable doesn’t mean it’s profitable or not. It is just him saying stuff to the public. As if any corporate exec is ever going to be truly honest in public. Taking away PR words as fact is not sustainable. It doesn’t work.

Not according to Phil in Nov 2021 https://www.essentiallysports.com/esports-news-not-the-only-focus-ps-seemingly-admits-game-pass-is-not-profitable-but-neither-is-xbox-console/ https://www.essentiallysports.com/esports-news-not-the-only-... At 15 dollars per month, 18 million subscribers, that's 3.25 billion dollars. They bought Betheseda for 7.5 billion. So now they're in the hole 4.25 billion and they still have to pay to run an entire extra company.

afjl 5y ago
Why would you report an acquisition's cost with the operating expenses of an ancillary service? You should compare the operating expenses of Game Pass with its revenues (i.e. Game Pass subscriptions), and you should compare Bethesda's acquisition cost + operating expenses against its projected revenues (i.e. Bethesda game sales/subscriptions. Apples to apples, oranges to oranges.
- fartcannon 5y ago
  We could do that, but that would hide the big picture. As Phil himself said, it's not yet profitable. It's a loss leader. True cost of ownership!
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    You are trolling at this point. I know we are to assume good faith, but the way you’re writing your replies. Repeating this Phil stuff. Combining two completely different things…
    - fartcannon 5y ago
      It's all Microsoft! The only way you sustain an unprofitable loss leader is by spending money from other parts of the company. To push game pass, theyve been buying IP. What's confusing about that? To There's no need for debasing accusations.
      - Talanes 5y ago
        That might all make sense if Bethesda didn't also bring them other revenue streams. I mean, Elder Scrolls Online alone brings in a completely separate subscription stream and cash shop.
      - skinnymuch 5y ago
        You keep ignoring every one saying that Bethesda acquisition which was Zenimax being acquired was also bought for other things and they got other things as well.
calsy 5y ago
where did you get 3.25 billion? is that a years worth of subscription income? Does game pass blow up after that or something? Have subscriptions just stopped, 18 million and ..... no more growth.
- fartcannon 5y ago
  If they keep buying stuff, they're not gonna make any money. It is thus a loss leader, as Phil indicated.
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    Microsoft is buying stuff. Game Pass isn’t buying stuff. Microsoft makes plenty of money. Notice how any one can decide where to draw the line of what is what. Why do you keep bringing Phil up. A loss leader isn’t the same thing as a growing SaaS. You are putting words in his mouth while repeating Phil said this, said that.
    - fartcannon 5y ago
      Yes, Microsoft makes plenty of money, that's how they're able to run game pass as a loss leader. Literally the original point.
      - skinnymuch 5y ago
        So then game pass doesn’t lose billions. It makes billions since Microsoft does. Using your logic of assigning expenses and profit any where
  - calsy 5y ago
    You understand those things they are buying have value right? That they are not just throwing money into the void. Investing in future growth is what businesses does in a competitive environment. If they don't keep buying stuff their service will fail and they will lose everything they had invested to that point. Thats how you don't make money.
skinnymuch 5y ago
Why would you count Bethesda? I don’t understand the rationale. It isn’t even like they are the same revenue stream. The article you linked does not say anything while adding up its word count. It’s common knowledge gaming companies say consoles never make a profit (except Nintendo). Game Pass is a fledgling growing SaaS. Of course sustainable is the right term. Nothing News worthy.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- fartcannon 5y ago
  It's an answer to the reply that said they were profitable. They're not. They're 'sustainable'. That's it.
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    Even if you want to be anal about this. Phil saying the words sustainable doesn’t mean it’s profitable or not. It is just him saying stuff to the public. As if any corporate exec is ever going to be truly honest in public. Taking away PR words as fact is not sustainable. It doesn’t work.