4 ms·

They have shifted greatly in France too (towards the right, very unusual for France). So is this really linked with Biden or linked with the social isolation?

yeetaccount4 5y ago
In my view, the issue is short term memory among voters and frustration with the political class and its inability to do do much at all. Since the other team is in office right now, people don’t like them.
_skzr 5y ago
One of the parties has been branded as the “Lockdown party” during covid. So long as there is a collective with the view that closing people’s businesses at any given time, indefinitely, without recourse, is acceptable - we can expect an endless stream of voters rushing to the other side of the aisle. Speak to right wingers and you’ll find that many will tell you they weren’t convinced by some right wing youTuber. It’s often the policy or rhetoric of the left that drove them away. A specific example in 2021, lockdown policies of the left may have had a far more profound impact on pushing people away than any random guest on Joe Rogan.
- whatshisface 5y ago
  They should set up a big clock, like the national debt clock, that counts up the lives saved through various pandemic response techniques (subtracting actual from forecast deaths?).
  - AlexandrB 5y ago
  - AlexTWithBeard 5y ago
    Agree. Add lives saved by various requirements. Subtract lives from increased traffic fatalities [1]. Multiply by the number of businesses decapitated by lockdowns. Do you know what we gonna end up with? I don't... [1] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/climate-and-people/car-crashes-fatality-rate-covid-19s-paradoxical-impact-road/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/climate-and-people...
    - whatshisface 5y ago
      You would not literally want to multiply by the number of business but I would be open to a dollar to life conversion made on the basis that you can spend money to feed people and perform medical services.
  - chasd00 5y ago
    That's nonsense. So pedestrian fatalities go down because everyone is trapped inside. Does that count as lives saved? If so then put a sentry in everyone's home and keep them there forever. Think of the lives saved!
    - whatshisface 5y ago
      Keeping things grounded, fatalities prevented by a policy are indeed lives saved.
- goalieca 5y ago
  Liberal values have been thoroughly rejected in favour of strong authoritarian measures. These policies often completely disregard decades of progressive policies. Lockdowns have definitely hurt nearly every major liberal issue and we don’t have much to show for it.
throw__away7391 5y ago
Agree, my thoughts exactly. There is something going on here related to the lockdowns/pandemic response. Just for myself personally, while no where near enough to change political affiliation, I've gotten quite sick of what appears to be hypocrisy, arrogance, and gross incompetence from the left establishment, expressed through the popular media, government policies, and generally the "blue check Twitter" crowd. We are now living in "TSA everywhere" land with all kinds of ridiculous sanctimony. I'm vaccinated, got a booster, caught and recovered from COVID initially and now again from omicron last month and still getting tested on a regular basis. When I go to a restaurant I have to show ID, vaccination proof, temperature check, leave a phone number, then wear a mask to walk 2 meters from the door to my table...where I can take off my mask and hang out for an hour surrounded by people doing the same...that is, unless I need to go to the bathroom. If I don't wear a mask while making the short walk from my table to the bathroom--oh my god, I'm basically single-handedly murdering old and immunocompromised people. It is hard for people to take you seriously when you are associated with this sort of emperor's new clothes COVID theater. This is literally the modern equivalent of the "or else the terrorists win" nonsense of the Global War on Terror era.
- tlogan 5y ago
  Here is my personal example of how this COVID rules ends up being stupid: - me and wife got Covid but we do not have symptoms - I have surgery (quite important and relatively urgent since it hurts) but it is delayed because I’m positive - my wife is a nurse but she forced to go to work because she has no symptoms Should I blame democrats on this? I do not know but they really love being “COVID police” …
  - mitchdoogle 5y ago
    It's not surprising in either case, you have a surgery that can be put off so as to not risk spreading a deadly virus in an environment with compromised individuals. Meanwhile the same hospital probably has a major need for staff, so your wife is allowed to continue working despite the risks because she has been trained on how to properly use PPE, and follow safety procedures where everyone else working there is doing same. Of all the places to complain about, a hospital seems one of the least warranted
avrionov 5y ago
The ruling party during Covid will suffer independently from the orientation. Take a look what is happening in the UK (Covid policies combined with self destruction on the side of the PM): https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1483121953166835714?t=2etbG6a2EIzPIZ4ZDRRXJQ&s=19 https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/148312195316683571...

yeetaccount4 5y ago

In my view, the issue is short term memory among voters and frustration with the political class and its inability to do do much at all. Since the other team is in office right now, people don’t like them.

_skzr 5y ago

One of the parties has been branded as the “Lockdown party” during covid. So long as there is a collective with the view that closing people’s businesses at any given time, indefinitely, without recourse, is acceptable - we can expect an endless stream of voters rushing to the other side of the aisle. Speak to right wingers and you’ll find that many will tell you they weren’t convinced by some right wing youTuber. It’s often the policy or rhetoric of the left that drove them away. A specific example in 2021, lockdown policies of the left may have had a far more profound impact on pushing people away than any random guest on Joe Rogan.

whatshisface 5y ago
They should set up a big clock, like the national debt clock, that counts up the lives saved through various pandemic response techniques (subtracting actual from forecast deaths?).
- AlexandrB 5y ago
- AlexTWithBeard 5y ago
  Agree. Add lives saved by various requirements. Subtract lives from increased traffic fatalities [1]. Multiply by the number of businesses decapitated by lockdowns. Do you know what we gonna end up with? I don't... [1] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/climate-and-people/car-crashes-fatality-rate-covid-19s-paradoxical-impact-road/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/climate-and-people...
  - whatshisface 5y ago
    You would not literally want to multiply by the number of business but I would be open to a dollar to life conversion made on the basis that you can spend money to feed people and perform medical services.
- chasd00 5y ago
  That's nonsense. So pedestrian fatalities go down because everyone is trapped inside. Does that count as lives saved? If so then put a sentry in everyone's home and keep them there forever. Think of the lives saved!
  - whatshisface 5y ago
    Keeping things grounded, fatalities prevented by a policy are indeed lives saved.
goalieca 5y ago
Liberal values have been thoroughly rejected in favour of strong authoritarian measures. These policies often completely disregard decades of progressive policies. Lockdowns have definitely hurt nearly every major liberal issue and we don’t have much to show for it.

throw__away7391 5y ago

Agree, my thoughts exactly. There is something going on here related to the lockdowns/pandemic response. Just for myself personally, while no where near enough to change political affiliation, I've gotten quite sick of what appears to be hypocrisy, arrogance, and gross incompetence from the left establishment, expressed through the popular media, government policies, and generally the "blue check Twitter" crowd. We are now living in "TSA everywhere" land with all kinds of ridiculous sanctimony. I'm vaccinated, got a booster, caught and recovered from COVID initially and now again from omicron last month and still getting tested on a regular basis. When I go to a restaurant I have to show ID, vaccination proof, temperature check, leave a phone number, then wear a mask to walk 2 meters from the door to my table...where I can take off my mask and hang out for an hour surrounded by people doing the same...that is, unless I need to go to the bathroom. If I don't wear a mask while making the short walk from my table to the bathroom--oh my god, I'm basically single-handedly murdering old and immunocompromised people. It is hard for people to take you seriously when you are associated with this sort of emperor's new clothes COVID theater. This is literally the modern equivalent of the "or else the terrorists win" nonsense of the Global War on Terror era.

tlogan 5y ago
Here is my personal example of how this COVID rules ends up being stupid: - me and wife got Covid but we do not have symptoms - I have surgery (quite important and relatively urgent since it hurts) but it is delayed because I’m positive - my wife is a nurse but she forced to go to work because she has no symptoms Should I blame democrats on this? I do not know but they really love being “COVID police” …
- mitchdoogle 5y ago
  It's not surprising in either case, you have a surgery that can be put off so as to not risk spreading a deadly virus in an environment with compromised individuals. Meanwhile the same hospital probably has a major need for staff, so your wife is allowed to continue working despite the risks because she has been trained on how to properly use PPE, and follow safety procedures where everyone else working there is doing same. Of all the places to complain about, a hospital seems one of the least warranted

avrionov 5y ago

The ruling party during Covid will suffer independently from the orientation. Take a look what is happening in the UK (Covid policies combined with self destruction on the side of the PM): https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1483121953166835714?t=2etbG6a2EIzPIZ4ZDRRXJQ&s=19 https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/148312195316683571...