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To me universal basic income is just that, universal. This feels like the government employing 2000 people and telling them to do nothing in particular. Also

To me universal basic income is just that, universal. This feels like the government employing 2000 people and telling them to do nothing in particular. Also it seems the payment is set to the Irish minimum wage of €10.50 p/h. I would love to know what an actual minimum wage worker thinks of this scheme.

MrPatan 5y ago
They'll become an artist
- swarnie 5y ago
  Oh yes, i expect the definition of that word to expand massively. Are we still doing coffee and subway artists?
  - wizzwizz4 5y ago
    Fortunately, this is a testable prediction. If you can nail it down a bit, maybe you could register it somewhere like https://predictionbook.com/ https://predictionbook.com/ ? After all, if you're right, having a track record to point to would increase your credibility.
smoyer 5y ago
Call me cynical but governments employ millions of people who effectively do nothing so a few thousand more won't cause a blip on the spending graph. My only consolation is that those who don't do anything don't cause as much harm as those who purport to serve their constituents via actual governing.
akuji1993 5y ago
> telling them to do nothing in particular Nobody told them anything close to that. Any research towards basic income tells us that people continue working close to as much as before. So this seems like a really unnecessary combative comment. Regarding minimum wage workers, one thing can be bad, while the other is also bad. So not really an argument.
- swarnie 5y ago
  > telling them to do nothing in particular As in not being given a task or directive for their income. I'm not saying they're told to literally do nothing.
- sharikous 5y ago
  > Any research towards basic income tells us that people continue working close to as much as before I am curious about the research in this field. Living in Israel I see the Ultra-Orthodox being payed for studying the scriptures and they work much less than their secular peers. Knowing corrupt countries, I know of tons of people employed by the state and local authorities just to give them jobs - it is a sign of malfunctioning and corruption usually - and they often do nothing in their job. What those examples have in common is that they create a class of people dependent on a party or on some politician to eat their meal. This entrenches tribalism and corruption. Also there is a very big difference between "universal basic income" - which would be an extension of human rights accorded to all, and paying some "artists" money. The former may be the evolution of the latter but there is no way to be certain. I am not familiar with Ireland but I suspect it is a trick of some party to secure thousands of certain votes, and probably even to use them for propaganda (I want to see those artists expose critical views of the party that gives them money..).
- tgv 5y ago
  From the other UBI thread: > Multiple studies of where basic income was tried in the real world found it to reduce work. > For example, "Manitoba, Canada experimented with Mincome, a basic guaranteed income, in the 1970s. In the town of Dauphin, Manitoba, labor only decreased by 13%, much less than expected" [1]. There are plenty of others. So not "any research". The research you think of are probably academic and/or pilot studies, which is absolutely not UBI. But I think the parent wrote in a hurry. It should probably have said "without demands or restrictions".

MrPatan 5y ago

They'll become an artist

swarnie 5y ago
Oh yes, i expect the definition of that word to expand massively. Are we still doing coffee and subway artists?
- wizzwizz4 5y ago
  Fortunately, this is a testable prediction. If you can nail it down a bit, maybe you could register it somewhere like https://predictionbook.com/ https://predictionbook.com/ ? After all, if you're right, having a track record to point to would increase your credibility.

smoyer 5y ago

Call me cynical but governments employ millions of people who effectively do nothing so a few thousand more won't cause a blip on the spending graph. My only consolation is that those who don't do anything don't cause as much harm as those who purport to serve their constituents via actual governing.

akuji1993 5y ago

> telling them to do nothing in particular Nobody told them anything close to that. Any research towards basic income tells us that people continue working close to as much as before. So this seems like a really unnecessary combative comment. Regarding minimum wage workers, one thing can be bad, while the other is also bad. So not really an argument.

swarnie 5y ago
> telling them to do nothing in particular As in not being given a task or directive for their income. I'm not saying they're told to literally do nothing.
sharikous 5y ago
> Any research towards basic income tells us that people continue working close to as much as before I am curious about the research in this field. Living in Israel I see the Ultra-Orthodox being payed for studying the scriptures and they work much less than their secular peers. Knowing corrupt countries, I know of tons of people employed by the state and local authorities just to give them jobs - it is a sign of malfunctioning and corruption usually - and they often do nothing in their job. What those examples have in common is that they create a class of people dependent on a party or on some politician to eat their meal. This entrenches tribalism and corruption. Also there is a very big difference between "universal basic income" - which would be an extension of human rights accorded to all, and paying some "artists" money. The former may be the evolution of the latter but there is no way to be certain. I am not familiar with Ireland but I suspect it is a trick of some party to secure thousands of certain votes, and probably even to use them for propaganda (I want to see those artists expose critical views of the party that gives them money..).
tgv 5y ago
From the other UBI thread: > Multiple studies of where basic income was tried in the real world found it to reduce work. > For example, "Manitoba, Canada experimented with Mincome, a basic guaranteed income, in the 1970s. In the town of Dauphin, Manitoba, labor only decreased by 13%, much less than expected" [1]. There are plenty of others. So not "any research". The research you think of are probably academic and/or pilot studies, which is absolutely not UBI. But I think the parent wrote in a hurry. It should probably have said "without demands or restrictions".