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I think this is one of those things where people generally agree that better insulation and lower energy costs is a good thing but who pays for it? In the UK,

I think this is one of those things where people generally agree that better insulation and lower energy costs is a good thing but who pays for it? In the UK, there is a constant demand for "affordable housing", which is caused by governments not controlling the housing market from either foreign investors or also people using the housing bubble to buy up loads of properties over time forcing others to rent. Bearing in mind how much profit a lot of home builders make, increasing the regulations is likely to add at least £20K to a basic house, significantly more if you include mechanical ventilation, triple-glazed windows and heat pumps (perhaps +£50K), which is some cases will be 50%+ of the original cost! Another major problem is the quality of building in the UK, mainly driven by a lack of tradespeople, and simply not having the skills to install to the quality levels required by thermally efficient houses like installing a membrane with zero holes in it, using the correct tapes, designing, installing and maintaining heat pumpes and various other things. I think these challenges will get better over time but that is probably why governments aren't keen to make large improvements in energy-efficiency regulations.

bogle 5y ago
> I think these challenges will get better over time but that is probably why governments aren't keen to make large improvements in energy-efficiency regulations. This is probably true but it's still backwards. The state should want to improve the affordability of housing and should consult with industry on which measures can be introduced but ultimately the state must introduce the new regulations to help drive the market in the direction of continuous improvements to the housing stock's long-term affordability. I think if they shirk this then they simply aren't doing the job properly.
Mvandenbergh 5y ago
>Bearing in mind how much profit a lot of home builders make, increasing the regulations is likely to add at least £20K to a basic house, significantly more if you include mechanical ventilation, triple-glazed windows and heat pumps (perhaps +£50K), which is some cases will be 50%+ of the original cost! The sales price of houses in the UK (and elsewhere) is driven by the market and there is a low amount of released, buildable land and a lot of demand in the Southeast. The land value (a large component of the value) is not actually set in an independent market but is based on the expected sales price minus construction costs and development costs. Therefore increasing the built cost of properties will decrease the value of land likely to receive planning permission without affecting purchase price by much. The marginal cost of thicker walls is also very low (especially compared to retrofit costs) so the impact on construction cost is nothing like £50k.
thebiss 5y ago
> Another major problem is the quality of building in the UK, mainly driven by a lack of tradespeople, and simply not having the skills to install to the quality levels required by thermally efficient houses like installing a membrane with zero holes in it, using the correct tapes, designing, installing and maintaining heat pumpes and various other things. It's an incentive and delegation problem. I'm in the US, and have been through three large renovations to family homes, and the trades I've worked were (nearly) all HIGHLY skilled, but had zero incentive to exceed energy efficiency goals required by code. The small business contractor needs to complete your project, get paid, and move on to the next. The best ones don't have any extra time - they're prospecting clients and building estimates for the next big project.
jayflux 5y ago
> Another major problem is the quality of building in the UK, mainly driven by a lack of tradespeople, and simply not having the skills to install to the quality levels required by thermally efficient houses like installing a membrane with zero holes in it, using the correct tapes, designing, installing and maintaining heat pumpes and various other things. I agree with the sibling comment this is an incentive problem rather than a skill problem. If house builders can cut corners they will. If they can sell a house for the same cost without the fancy new insulation gear they will. This is why your bit about regulation is needed because otherwise the things you list won’t happen. Home chargers are a good example which the govt deemed necessary for new builds, the skill will be there for that and without the regulation I’m not sure most builders would have bothered, leaving people to retrofit one further down the line paying a higher cost. The skills for heat pumps will organically grow as regulation kicks in too. > why governments aren't keen to make large improvements in energy-efficiency regulations. The govt have been consulting with various business and institutions on future building standards you can view their response here: https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/the-future-buildings-standard https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/the-future-build.... But from it we've already had EV charging point requirements, ban on gas boilers, new homes in England will have to produce around 30% less carbon emissions, plus raising the standard for insulation.
- tonyedgecombe 5y ago
  Interestingly the previous Labour government had raised the standards for insulation but one of the first things Cameron did was abandon that legislation. This stuff is so frustrating.

bogle 5y ago

> I think these challenges will get better over time but that is probably why governments aren't keen to make large improvements in energy-efficiency regulations. This is probably true but it's still backwards. The state should want to improve the affordability of housing and should consult with industry on which measures can be introduced but ultimately the state must introduce the new regulations to help drive the market in the direction of continuous improvements to the housing stock's long-term affordability. I think if they shirk this then they simply aren't doing the job properly.

Mvandenbergh 5y ago

>Bearing in mind how much profit a lot of home builders make, increasing the regulations is likely to add at least £20K to a basic house, significantly more if you include mechanical ventilation, triple-glazed windows and heat pumps (perhaps +£50K), which is some cases will be 50%+ of the original cost! The sales price of houses in the UK (and elsewhere) is driven by the market and there is a low amount of released, buildable land and a lot of demand in the Southeast. The land value (a large component of the value) is not actually set in an independent market but is based on the expected sales price minus construction costs and development costs. Therefore increasing the built cost of properties will decrease the value of land likely to receive planning permission without affecting purchase price by much. The marginal cost of thicker walls is also very low (especially compared to retrofit costs) so the impact on construction cost is nothing like £50k.

thebiss 5y ago

jayflux 5y ago

> Another major problem is the quality of building in the UK, mainly driven by a lack of tradespeople, and simply not having the skills to install to the quality levels required by thermally efficient houses like installing a membrane with zero holes in it, using the correct tapes, designing, installing and maintaining heat pumpes and various other things. I agree with the sibling comment this is an incentive problem rather than a skill problem. If house builders can cut corners they will. If they can sell a house for the same cost without the fancy new insulation gear they will. This is why your bit about regulation is needed because otherwise the things you list won’t happen. Home chargers are a good example which the govt deemed necessary for new builds, the skill will be there for that and without the regulation I’m not sure most builders would have bothered, leaving people to retrofit one further down the line paying a higher cost. The skills for heat pumps will organically grow as regulation kicks in too. > why governments aren't keen to make large improvements in energy-efficiency regulations. The govt have been consulting with various business and institutions on future building standards you can view their response here: https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/the-future-buildings-standard https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/the-future-build.... But from it we've already had EV charging point requirements, ban on gas boilers, new homes in England will have to produce around 30% less carbon emissions, plus raising the standard for insulation.

tonyedgecombe 5y ago
Interestingly the previous Labour government had raised the standards for insulation but one of the first things Cameron did was abandon that legislation. This stuff is so frustrating.