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I'm convinced that some folks cannot be taught critical thinking skills, some folks I think are just missing the relevant hardware to perform the needed computi

by Aloha 5y ago

I'm convinced that some folks cannot be taught critical thinking skills, some folks I think are just missing the relevant hardware to perform the needed computing, they might be able to get there in a round about way, but not on every topic. Ideological blinders, presuppositions, a bunch of things, get in the way.

SavantIdiot 5y ago
I'd say 99% of folks based on my 50+ years of experience on- and off-line. I think I've only known a handful of people who can think critically about their opinions.
- visarga 5y ago
  I think causal/critical reasoning is not natural to humans, it has to be learned and can only be applied in limited fields. Humans by nature have survival thinking, not critical thinking. Of course survival depends on taking the correct decisions and that tends to correct some errors in thinking, but not all. Interesting, the same applies to GPT-3. It just memorizes the surface of things without critical understanding. But that means it's just doing what the average human does, while being compared to the idealized critical thinking human.
lukifer 5y ago
See also, the work of Robert Trivers [0] on the evolutionary utility of strategic self-deception. Sometimes we deceive ourselves so we may more effectively deceive others (or more charitably, perhaps to signal in-group loyalty). Ironically enough, I think this can even take the form of an irrational belief that humans are innately rational, when empirical observation tells us otherwise. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Folly_of_Fools https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Folly_of_Fools
somenameforme 5y ago
I don't think it's about the computing, but about the entire shift in worldview required to accept that what you perceive to be true isn't necessarily so. This is much more of an emotional issue than a logical or analytical one. It also naturally trends towards Betrand Russell's, "The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt." It's one thing to state you understand this and another altogether to live it. It's not pleasant. And I find many who even claim to have adopted this sort of worldview are instead just as cocksure of themselves, but instead of meeting other notions with rejection, they meet them with 'compassionate condescension.'
kqr 5y ago
There may be something to this; Slate Star Codex referred to it as cognitive developmental milestones. https://slatestarcodex.com/2015/11/03/what-developmental-milestones-are-you-missing/ https://slatestarcodex.com/2015/11/03/what-developmental-mil...

by Aloha 5y ago

SavantIdiot 5y ago

I'd say 99% of folks based on my 50+ years of experience on- and off-line. I think I've only known a handful of people who can think critically about their opinions.

visarga 5y ago
I think causal/critical reasoning is not natural to humans, it has to be learned and can only be applied in limited fields. Humans by nature have survival thinking, not critical thinking. Of course survival depends on taking the correct decisions and that tends to correct some errors in thinking, but not all. Interesting, the same applies to GPT-3. It just memorizes the surface of things without critical understanding. But that means it's just doing what the average human does, while being compared to the idealized critical thinking human.

lukifer 5y ago

See also, the work of Robert Trivers [0] on the evolutionary utility of strategic self-deception. Sometimes we deceive ourselves so we may more effectively deceive others (or more charitably, perhaps to signal in-group loyalty). Ironically enough, I think this can even take the form of an irrational belief that humans are innately rational, when empirical observation tells us otherwise. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Folly_of_Fools https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Folly_of_Fools

somenameforme 5y ago

I don't think it's about the computing, but about the entire shift in worldview required to accept that what you perceive to be true isn't necessarily so. This is much more of an emotional issue than a logical or analytical one. It also naturally trends towards Betrand Russell's, "The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt." It's one thing to state you understand this and another altogether to live it. It's not pleasant. And I find many who even claim to have adopted this sort of worldview are instead just as cocksure of themselves, but instead of meeting other notions with rejection, they meet them with 'compassionate condescension.'

kqr 5y ago

There may be something to this; Slate Star Codex referred to it as cognitive developmental milestones. https://slatestarcodex.com/2015/11/03/what-developmental-milestones-are-you-missing/ https://slatestarcodex.com/2015/11/03/what-developmental-mil...