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The intended effect of the vaccines was to reduce the mortality and the severe morbidity of infection and thereby reduce the human burden of the disease and ind

The intended effect of the vaccines was to reduce the mortality and the severe morbidity of infection and thereby reduce the human burden of the disease and indirectly protect the capacity of healthcare systems to function. In this respect, the vaccines have been enormously successful. Were that not so, the incidence of the omicron variant would have already caused healthcare systems worldwide to collapse.

lambdaba 5y ago
Having omnicron "rip through" would actually be a great thing, I've just read an article from Belgium saying they have no patients with omnicron in ICUs. It does seem some people need supervision but I presume the load is much much reduced. Also omnicron doesn't seem to spare vaccinated neither in symptoms nor in infection rate, but that's just anecdotal, maybe someone has other information?
- rsfern 5y ago
  Do you have a source on Belgium? I found this article from a week ago that says that a single hospital (as far as I can tell) had no omicron icu patients at time of publication, but it also indicates that they might not be tracking it that systematically? Anyway, I don’t really think there’s all that much mitigation possible, but I’m not convinced “let it rip” is necessarily a good thing depending on vaccination rates (I’m in the US, we’ll see how it goes) https://www.brusselstimes.com/health/200725/omicron-dominating-general-population-delta-seemingly-still-presiding-in-hospitals https://www.brusselstimes.com/health/200725/omicron-dominati...
the_doctah 5y ago
Revisionist history at its best. If that was the intended effect, officials sure weren't very clear about it.
- epgui 5y ago
  Uhmm, I don't know where you were getting your information, but yes, it was pretty clear.
  - lordloki 5y ago
    prove it!
  - lordloki 5y ago
    "I would say 50% would have to get vaccinated before you start to see an impact," Fauci said. "But I would say 75 to 85% would have to get vaccinated if you want to have that blanket of herd immunity." https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/12/15/946714505/fauci-predicts-u-s-could-see-signs-of-herd-immunity-by-late-march-or-early-april https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/1... the fraction of people who would need immunity to SARS-CoV-2 (either through vaccination or recovery from prior infection) to extinguish the spread of the virus was initially estimated to be 60% to 70%. https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/90445 https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/90445 Estimates based on measles and other diseases suggest that herd immunity occurs when 70%-80% of the population is vaccinated. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/dr-fauci-what-herd-immunity-against-covid-would-look-like.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/dr-fauci-what-herd-immunity-... I'm not sure if you have a very poor memory or you're just lying, but everyone was pushing the idea that the covid vaccines were sterilizing and would push us to reach herd immunity and eradicate Covid-19.
    - epgui 5y ago
      That might all be true, but it’s all cherry picked out of context. Had we had broad vaccine immunity in the early days of the pandemic, the situation may have turned out differently. Over time, things change.
      - rhino369 5y ago
        Officials, Pfizer, and Moderna were loudly celebrating the "94%" or "95%" effectiveness, which was measured in symptomatic cases. Now its 0-20% w/o a booster. The vaccine is clearly less effective than before, which is understandable given the new variant. But it's definitely disappointing--a lot more people will die because the herd immunity clock got reset.
lordloki 5y ago
Nonsense. That is not what was originally stated. I'm not sure if you're intentionally gaslighting here or what, but the original premise of the vaccine was to reach herd immunity. That is what Fauci was preaching every day last spring to convince the populace to get vaccinated. Once it was realized that the vaccine was not immunizing the population, the narrative changed to what you claim.

lambdaba 5y ago

Having omnicron "rip through" would actually be a great thing, I've just read an article from Belgium saying they have no patients with omnicron in ICUs. It does seem some people need supervision but I presume the load is much much reduced. Also omnicron doesn't seem to spare vaccinated neither in symptoms nor in infection rate, but that's just anecdotal, maybe someone has other information?

rsfern 5y ago
Do you have a source on Belgium? I found this article from a week ago that says that a single hospital (as far as I can tell) had no omicron icu patients at time of publication, but it also indicates that they might not be tracking it that systematically? Anyway, I don’t really think there’s all that much mitigation possible, but I’m not convinced “let it rip” is necessarily a good thing depending on vaccination rates (I’m in the US, we’ll see how it goes) https://www.brusselstimes.com/health/200725/omicron-dominating-general-population-delta-seemingly-still-presiding-in-hospitals https://www.brusselstimes.com/health/200725/omicron-dominati...

the_doctah 5y ago

Revisionist history at its best. If that was the intended effect, officials sure weren't very clear about it.

epgui 5y ago
Uhmm, I don't know where you were getting your information, but yes, it was pretty clear.
- lordloki 5y ago
  prove it!
- lordloki 5y ago
  "I would say 50% would have to get vaccinated before you start to see an impact," Fauci said. "But I would say 75 to 85% would have to get vaccinated if you want to have that blanket of herd immunity." https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/12/15/946714505/fauci-predicts-u-s-could-see-signs-of-herd-immunity-by-late-march-or-early-april https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/1... the fraction of people who would need immunity to SARS-CoV-2 (either through vaccination or recovery from prior infection) to extinguish the spread of the virus was initially estimated to be 60% to 70%. https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/90445 https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/90445 Estimates based on measles and other diseases suggest that herd immunity occurs when 70%-80% of the population is vaccinated. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/dr-fauci-what-herd-immunity-against-covid-would-look-like.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/dr-fauci-what-herd-immunity-... I'm not sure if you have a very poor memory or you're just lying, but everyone was pushing the idea that the covid vaccines were sterilizing and would push us to reach herd immunity and eradicate Covid-19.
  - epgui 5y ago
    That might all be true, but it’s all cherry picked out of context. Had we had broad vaccine immunity in the early days of the pandemic, the situation may have turned out differently. Over time, things change.
    - rhino369 5y ago
      Officials, Pfizer, and Moderna were loudly celebrating the "94%" or "95%" effectiveness, which was measured in symptomatic cases. Now its 0-20% w/o a booster. The vaccine is clearly less effective than before, which is understandable given the new variant. But it's definitely disappointing--a lot more people will die because the herd immunity clock got reset.

lordloki 5y ago

Nonsense. That is not what was originally stated. I'm not sure if you're intentionally gaslighting here or what, but the original premise of the vaccine was to reach herd immunity. That is what Fauci was preaching every day last spring to convince the populace to get vaccinated. Once it was realized that the vaccine was not immunizing the population, the narrative changed to what you claim.