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The definition of "manipulated" which allows "the dollar and BTC are both being manipulated" to resolve as true is so broad that it is effectively meaningless.

The definition of "manipulated" which allows "the dollar and BTC are both being manipulated" to resolve as true is so broad that it is effectively meaningless. The dollar is not being manipulated in the way that reasonable people understand the word to mean. BTC obviously is.

notch656a 5y ago
No true [reasonable] Scotsman would believe monetary policy by fed is manipulation. Got it; your definition of unreasonable is so broad that it is effectively meaningless.
- preseinger 5y ago
  The Fed has a mandate to act in the broad interest of society. It doesn't manipulate currency by any non-conspiratorial definition of manipulate, no.
  - notch656a 5y ago
    Ah I see, it's not manipulation because you perceive the fed as acting virtuously. That's actually not the mandate of the fed. The mandate is: The Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System and the Federal Open Market Committee shall maintain long run growth of the monetary and credit aggregates commensurate with the economy's long run potential to increase production, so as to promote effectively the goals of maximum employment, stable prices, and moderate long-term interest rates. Whether prices are currently stable or interest rates are moderate are a lively source of discussion. Regardless of opinion here, I think you have a generous definition of manipulation to exclude acts operating under a nominal mandate of some vague interest of society (and I may add many other acts made under pretext of interest in society are source of outrage on HN).
    - preseinger 5y ago
      I, an anonymous actor beholden to no authority nor regulation, can manipulate Bitcoin _directly_ with sufficient capital and a sufficiently intelligent bit of code. It's fun and intellectually pointed to say this is just a _version_ of the kind of "manipulation" performed by the Fed against the dollar but it's transparently and categorically a different thing. It's an obviously specious argument and it diminishes whomever makes it.
      - notch656a 5y ago
        >I, an anonymous actor beholden to no authority nor regulation, can manipulate Bitcoin Yes yes we already agreed, I think, that bitcoin can be manipulated. I admitted this right off the bat. >It's fun and intellectually pointed to say this is just a _version_ of the kind of "manipulation" performed by the Fed against the dollar but it's transparently and categorically a different thing. It's an obviously specious argument and it diminishes whomever makes it. So it diminishes no one, because I never said the manipulation performed by the fed was the same 'version' or 'kind' of manipulation -- whatever that means. Are you just kind of arguing with yourself at this point?

notch656a 5y ago

No true [reasonable] Scotsman would believe monetary policy by fed is manipulation. Got it; your definition of unreasonable is so broad that it is effectively meaningless.

preseinger 5y ago
The Fed has a mandate to act in the broad interest of society. It doesn't manipulate currency by any non-conspiratorial definition of manipulate, no.
- notch656a 5y ago
  Ah I see, it's not manipulation because you perceive the fed as acting virtuously. That's actually not the mandate of the fed. The mandate is: The Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System and the Federal Open Market Committee shall maintain long run growth of the monetary and credit aggregates commensurate with the economy's long run potential to increase production, so as to promote effectively the goals of maximum employment, stable prices, and moderate long-term interest rates. Whether prices are currently stable or interest rates are moderate are a lively source of discussion. Regardless of opinion here, I think you have a generous definition of manipulation to exclude acts operating under a nominal mandate of some vague interest of society (and I may add many other acts made under pretext of interest in society are source of outrage on HN).
  - preseinger 5y ago
    I, an anonymous actor beholden to no authority nor regulation, can manipulate Bitcoin _directly_ with sufficient capital and a sufficiently intelligent bit of code. It's fun and intellectually pointed to say this is just a _version_ of the kind of "manipulation" performed by the Fed against the dollar but it's transparently and categorically a different thing. It's an obviously specious argument and it diminishes whomever makes it.
    - notch656a 5y ago
      >I, an anonymous actor beholden to no authority nor regulation, can manipulate Bitcoin Yes yes we already agreed, I think, that bitcoin can be manipulated. I admitted this right off the bat. >It's fun and intellectually pointed to say this is just a _version_ of the kind of "manipulation" performed by the Fed against the dollar but it's transparently and categorically a different thing. It's an obviously specious argument and it diminishes whomever makes it. So it diminishes no one, because I never said the manipulation performed by the fed was the same 'version' or 'kind' of manipulation -- whatever that means. Are you just kind of arguing with yourself at this point?