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You're ignoring the fact that they chose not to work during a pandemic, at jobs that almost universally had very poor protection for employees - little to no PP

You're ignoring the fact that they chose not to work during a pandemic, at jobs that almost universally had very poor protection for employees - little to no PPE, in some cases not even hand sanitizer and/or soap (i.e. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/mar/18/amazon-whole-foods-workers-stores-warehouses-coronavirus https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/mar/18/amazon-wh..., though I can't remember which warehouse had no soap). That is not applicable to UBI. Also keep in mind that during this time period many schools were closed, so some of these people were staying home to monitor their children, not just "deciding not to work". Parenting is labor.

tengbretson 5y ago
> You're ignoring the fact that they chose not to work during a pandemic, at jobs that almost universally had very poor protection for employees - little to no PPE, in some cases not even hand sanitizer and/or soap Are you friends with any roofers?
seibelj 5y ago
We need roofs fixed and structures to be made safe to live in. We are still in a pandemic - should we keep paying people not to work? Eventually nature ruins our structures and people are homeless. I just don’t see how your logic is sound.
- kevingadd 5y ago
  If you're saying you think rooftops are more important than lives, I don't know what to tell you. If roofers are refusing to show up to work because they'd rather accept fairly small checks from the government, maybe you need to offer them better pay or better health safeguards? We've had lots of people die during all this. One reason the pandemic has lasted so long is that we've refused to take difficult measures, so instead we drag it out and people keep getting exposed. There are countries on this planet that have gone back to normal without these issues, because they took more difficult measures early on.
  - seibelj 5y ago
    It’s called Florida - no one wears masks anywhere there. Death rates are middle of the pack.
    - kevingadd 5y ago
      Instead of "middle of the pack" you could be at the bottom of the pack like New Zealand - ~15k total cases, 50 deaths reported, vs Florida's 5 million reported cases and 63k deaths. The population ratio is ~1/4, so it's slightly less bad for Florida than it looks. Of course, that's an unreasonable target, but it's an example of a real western nation managing COVID at scale. Your only choice isn't to just let everyone get the disease and hope herd immunity kicks in fast enough while praying that Long COVID doesn't cause problems later.

tengbretson 5y ago

> You're ignoring the fact that they chose not to work during a pandemic, at jobs that almost universally had very poor protection for employees - little to no PPE, in some cases not even hand sanitizer and/or soap Are you friends with any roofers?

seibelj 5y ago

We need roofs fixed and structures to be made safe to live in. We are still in a pandemic - should we keep paying people not to work? Eventually nature ruins our structures and people are homeless. I just don’t see how your logic is sound.

kevingadd 5y ago
If you're saying you think rooftops are more important than lives, I don't know what to tell you. If roofers are refusing to show up to work because they'd rather accept fairly small checks from the government, maybe you need to offer them better pay or better health safeguards? We've had lots of people die during all this. One reason the pandemic has lasted so long is that we've refused to take difficult measures, so instead we drag it out and people keep getting exposed. There are countries on this planet that have gone back to normal without these issues, because they took more difficult measures early on.
- seibelj 5y ago
  It’s called Florida - no one wears masks anywhere there. Death rates are middle of the pack.
  - kevingadd 5y ago
    Instead of "middle of the pack" you could be at the bottom of the pack like New Zealand - ~15k total cases, 50 deaths reported, vs Florida's 5 million reported cases and 63k deaths. The population ratio is ~1/4, so it's slightly less bad for Florida than it looks. Of course, that's an unreasonable target, but it's an example of a real western nation managing COVID at scale. Your only choice isn't to just let everyone get the disease and hope herd immunity kicks in fast enough while praying that Long COVID doesn't cause problems later.