4 ms·

My "Working While Standing" Hack

41 points by bearwithclaws 15y ago

kilian 15y ago
Nice list, though I'm not sure if longer breaks and longer periods of sitting are as good as more frequent breaks. The last suggestion, dancing, is a very good one (And one I should do more). There is one thing that's even better then sitting and standing, and that's moving (hence the treadmill-inder-desk phenomenon) so if you don't have a treadmill, dancing is a good second ;)
adaml_623 15y ago
Yeah I'm sorry but you can't argue with science. "Sitting for more than 1 hour has been shown to induce biochemical changes ... leads to the deposit of fats in adipose tissue rather than these being metabolized by muscle, ... heart disease risks". Read the original article for details. Apparently we have a tradeoff between staying in "flow" and staying healthy. Since that seems to be the choice at the moment then I'll move every half an hour and worry about my productivity using other hacks.
- KirinDave 15y ago
  Or you could just get good at keeping flow while not staring right at your code. I know I'm not the only person who occasionally likes to get up and walk around as I chew through a problem in my head. Surely this doesn't constitute a break in "flow".
  - alnayyir 15y ago
    >get up and walk around as I chew through a problem in my head. Surely this doesn't constitute a break in "flow". I'm afraid it most certainly does for myself and other programmers I know. My "walking around and contemplating" is a completely different mental state than flow for me, and flow produces an entirely different league of results above and beyond any other mode of working I've been in. If I could discipline, harness, and achieve flow more quickly (like the people who teach themselves to dream lucidly) I would be a much better programmer. As it is, I'm currently contemplating how to cope with the apparent health risks of sitting all day vs. achieving flow. Going even a week without flow tends to depress me, I doubt I could make disrupting my work multiple times daily a regular part of my habits.
    - nowarninglabel 15y ago
      Wireless headphones. The quality isn't as good, but they do wonders for allowing me to get up and move, whilst staying in the flow. Might want to give it a try.
      - alnayyir 15y ago
        I walk around plugged into my iPhone, portability isn't the issue, perturbing my physical state is. If I have to pause to think to move around or have an alarm that does this for me, I'm going to lose flow instantly. Edit: Point being, I've never been in a state of flow that lent me the presence of mind to be able to tell myself, "Time to get up and move around", and any attempts to do so would destroy it.
      - erikcw 15y ago
        I picked up an OfficeRunner [http://www.officerunner.com/ http://www.officerunner.com/] headset last year. I spend 4+ hours a day on skype calls -- the ability to step away from my desk has been priceless. I originally looked for an app for my iPhone that would function as a wireless headset. There are one or two in the app store, but they all have latency issues...
    - KirinDave 15y ago
      Maybe we just work in different problem domains. For me, the _easy_ part is writing the code. Figuring out what to write and how the system should be designed (or what is slow about this piece of code) is the hard part. I could see how some problem domains wouldn't be amenable to this.
      - alnayyir 15y ago
        The code writing isn't the hard part per se, it's simply that I work for a startup and have a lot of work to do. My best design decisions and code and productivity come out of flow. I'm into functional languages like you are, but my background is in Lisp and Scheme where the cultural norm is to do bottom-up design and refactor/redesign as you go. If I feel trapped into my decisions, I've written poor code or made an uncommonly bad design.
Mits 15y ago
I developed a bad back from sitting all day and was always worried an injury would be round the corner. However, I've been following the tips found in this ebook www.weakbackbuilder.com and I've now got a much stronger back and don't really feel the need to work standing up. Also I've converted to using a kneeling chair which also really helps, I def. suggest a kneeling chair if you spend hours coding.
jfoucher 15y ago
Dancing definitely makes it easier on the legs and feet, as you're not stuck in the same static position all day. Alternatively contracting and relaxing the calf is necessary to achieve return blood flow up the leg. If you stand without moving, you are at risk of varicose veins and such things, but this effect is much reduced if you are dancing at the same time. Plus, it's loads of fun!
colinhowe 15y ago
I do a similar thing. I also have a variety of objects under my desk at different heights so I can rest my feet in different positions and do whatever feels comfortable. My desk isn't adjustable (atm) and one of the biggest (but unexpected) benefits of standing at my desk is that it tires me. After two hours or so I am forced to go have a sit down _away_ from my computer. This helps my productivity more than trying to take regular breaks when sitting as I find it harder to waste the time browsing the internet or simply skip a break.
bryanlarsen 15y ago
I like his last comment: "dance". I'm glad I work from home, because if I'm standing at work and a great dance tune comes through my mix (currently Basie doing Shiny Stockings) I can't stand still.
baggachipz 15y ago
Geekdesk FTW. I stand almost all day now, it's great.
Michielvv 15y ago
I have to disagree on taking a break every 20 to 30 minutes being in conflict with getting into flow. If I apply the Pomodoro method and set a fixed time for the break to start, I found that for me it's actually quite easy to get back onto the problem after the short break. What I think makes the difference is that forcing the break, although annoying at first, makes you take the break when things are going well, resulting in eagerness to continue solving the problem after the break. While, if you take a break when you feel you need one, things are probably already stuck and it's harder to start up again. I do agree with getting away from the computer for a proper break every few hours, but isn't that quite natural already? I can't go without eating/drinking for much longer than that anyway.
Kell 15y ago
http://gregschlom.com/post/4555981908/standing-desk http://gregschlom.com/post/4555981908/standing-desk
tzs 15y ago
Some have suggested that using any kind of timer to remind them to get up and walk around will interrupt the flow, and if they don't have a reminder they will not get up often enough. For those who like to listen to music while coding, you can use your music to help with this. Simply queue up ~30 minutes worth of songs, and then get to work. When the music ends that probably won't be enough of a distraction to pull you out of the flow, but realizing will slowly bubble its way to the surface that the music has stopped. When that happens, you can put on another ~30 minutes of music after taking your walk-around break. Repeat. I find that this doesn't disrupt flow, because the "time to change music" event is not an interrupt. I think being in the flow is a lot like sleep in that it goes through cycles much like the sleep stages, and you become aware of the music having stopped at a stage in the flow where it is easy to stop and restart. BTW, music also makes a great way to keep track of time for billing. Back in our consulting days at work, I'd keep track of how much time was spent for each client by what CDs I listened to while working on that client's project.

41 points by bearwithclaws 15y ago

Nice list, though I'm not sure if longer breaks and longer periods of sitting are as good as more frequent breaks. The last suggestion, dancing, is a very good one (And one I should do more). There is one thing that's even better then sitting and standing, and that's moving (hence the treadmill-inder-desk phenomenon) so if you don't have a treadmill, dancing is a good second ;)

adaml_623 15y ago

Yeah I'm sorry but you can't argue with science. "Sitting for more than 1 hour has been shown to induce biochemical changes ... leads to the deposit of fats in adipose tissue rather than these being metabolized by muscle, ... heart disease risks". Read the original article for details. Apparently we have a tradeoff between staying in "flow" and staying healthy. Since that seems to be the choice at the moment then I'll move every half an hour and worry about my productivity using other hacks.

KirinDave 15y ago
Or you could just get good at keeping flow while not staring right at your code. I know I'm not the only person who occasionally likes to get up and walk around as I chew through a problem in my head. Surely this doesn't constitute a break in "flow".
- alnayyir 15y ago
  >get up and walk around as I chew through a problem in my head. Surely this doesn't constitute a break in "flow". I'm afraid it most certainly does for myself and other programmers I know. My "walking around and contemplating" is a completely different mental state than flow for me, and flow produces an entirely different league of results above and beyond any other mode of working I've been in. If I could discipline, harness, and achieve flow more quickly (like the people who teach themselves to dream lucidly) I would be a much better programmer. As it is, I'm currently contemplating how to cope with the apparent health risks of sitting all day vs. achieving flow. Going even a week without flow tends to depress me, I doubt I could make disrupting my work multiple times daily a regular part of my habits.
  - nowarninglabel 15y ago
    Wireless headphones. The quality isn't as good, but they do wonders for allowing me to get up and move, whilst staying in the flow. Might want to give it a try.
    - alnayyir 15y ago
      I walk around plugged into my iPhone, portability isn't the issue, perturbing my physical state is. If I have to pause to think to move around or have an alarm that does this for me, I'm going to lose flow instantly. Edit: Point being, I've never been in a state of flow that lent me the presence of mind to be able to tell myself, "Time to get up and move around", and any attempts to do so would destroy it.
    - erikcw 15y ago
      I picked up an OfficeRunner [http://www.officerunner.com/ http://www.officerunner.com/] headset last year. I spend 4+ hours a day on skype calls -- the ability to step away from my desk has been priceless. I originally looked for an app for my iPhone that would function as a wireless headset. There are one or two in the app store, but they all have latency issues...
  - KirinDave 15y ago
    Maybe we just work in different problem domains. For me, the _easy_ part is writing the code. Figuring out what to write and how the system should be designed (or what is slow about this piece of code) is the hard part. I could see how some problem domains wouldn't be amenable to this.
    - alnayyir 15y ago
      The code writing isn't the hard part per se, it's simply that I work for a startup and have a lot of work to do. My best design decisions and code and productivity come out of flow. I'm into functional languages like you are, but my background is in Lisp and Scheme where the cultural norm is to do bottom-up design and refactor/redesign as you go. If I feel trapped into my decisions, I've written poor code or made an uncommonly bad design.

Mits 15y ago

I developed a bad back from sitting all day and was always worried an injury would be round the corner. However, I've been following the tips found in this ebook www.weakbackbuilder.com and I've now got a much stronger back and don't really feel the need to work standing up. Also I've converted to using a kneeling chair which also really helps, I def. suggest a kneeling chair if you spend hours coding.

jfoucher 15y ago

Dancing definitely makes it easier on the legs and feet, as you're not stuck in the same static position all day. Alternatively contracting and relaxing the calf is necessary to achieve return blood flow up the leg. If you stand without moving, you are at risk of varicose veins and such things, but this effect is much reduced if you are dancing at the same time. Plus, it's loads of fun!

colinhowe 15y ago

I do a similar thing. I also have a variety of objects under my desk at different heights so I can rest my feet in different positions and do whatever feels comfortable. My desk isn't adjustable (atm) and one of the biggest (but unexpected) benefits of standing at my desk is that it tires me. After two hours or so I am forced to go have a sit down _away_ from my computer. This helps my productivity more than trying to take regular breaks when sitting as I find it harder to waste the time browsing the internet or simply skip a break.

bryanlarsen 15y ago

I like his last comment: "dance". I'm glad I work from home, because if I'm standing at work and a great dance tune comes through my mix (currently Basie doing Shiny Stockings) I can't stand still.

baggachipz 15y ago

Geekdesk FTW. I stand almost all day now, it's great.

Michielvv 15y ago

I have to disagree on taking a break every 20 to 30 minutes being in conflict with getting into flow. If I apply the Pomodoro method and set a fixed time for the break to start, I found that for me it's actually quite easy to get back onto the problem after the short break. What I think makes the difference is that forcing the break, although annoying at first, makes you take the break when things are going well, resulting in eagerness to continue solving the problem after the break. While, if you take a break when you feel you need one, things are probably already stuck and it's harder to start up again. I do agree with getting away from the computer for a proper break every few hours, but isn't that quite natural already? I can't go without eating/drinking for much longer than that anyway.

Kell 15y ago

http://gregschlom.com/post/4555981908/standing-desk http://gregschlom.com/post/4555981908/standing-desk

tzs 15y ago

Some have suggested that using any kind of timer to remind them to get up and walk around will interrupt the flow, and if they don't have a reminder they will not get up often enough. For those who like to listen to music while coding, you can use your music to help with this. Simply queue up ~30 minutes worth of songs, and then get to work. When the music ends that probably won't be enough of a distraction to pull you out of the flow, but realizing will slowly bubble its way to the surface that the music has stopped. When that happens, you can put on another ~30 minutes of music after taking your walk-around break. Repeat. I find that this doesn't disrupt flow, because the "time to change music" event is not an interrupt. I think being in the flow is a lot like sleep in that it goes through cycles much like the sleep stages, and you become aware of the music having stopped at a stage in the flow where it is easy to stop and restart. BTW, music also makes a great way to keep track of time for billing. Back in our consulting days at work, I'd keep track of how much time was spent for each client by what CDs I listened to while working on that client's project.