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> And there's none of Trek's "fix this week's problem, then never mention this incredibly overpowered solution again". The tech jumped the shark at the start o

> And there's none of Trek's "fix this week's problem, then never mention this incredibly overpowered solution again". The tech jumped the shark at the start of season 5 with the introduction of Prometheus, but things like the device built in the "Fifth Race" episode, it could open a wormhole to another galaxy, it was used in one more episode "Point of View", then conveniently forgotten about. There's a few examples like that, but overall it was a good show. I wouldn't call it fundamentally atheist either, in fact the entire thing was about religion, especially the last two seasons.

walterbell 5y ago
> in fact the entire thing was about religion So many cosmology storylines about the role of tech as go(o)d proof, including: False gods (Goa'uld) Ascended Beings / Ancients Egyptian history (Ra, Osiris,..) Bio-mechanical-AI Lotan (S4E9, terraformer) Purgatory (semi-ascended, Oma Desala) Immaculate conception (Adria/Ori) Merlin, Grail, Arthurian legends Hallowed are the Ori Transhumanism (symbiotes, Ancient tech) Asgard cloning/transasgardism Asgard time-dilation & time-reversal Multiverses Multiple dimensions
flir 5y ago
Well religion, yes, absolutely, but behind every religion was a false God. (Dead false God). I'd call that implicitly athiest. By those last two seasons they're basically fighting mediaeval Christians. I don't think you can get much more obvious than that. There's only one "religion is good" story off the top of my head (when the Asgard are introduced as protectors of the Viking planet), and in that one the religion is meant to be outgrown (there's a test).
- hericium 5y ago
  > There's only one "religion is good" story off the top of my head (when the Asgard are introduced as protectors of the Viking planet), and in that one the religion is meant to be outgrown. Great example. It pointed out that religion/mythology is bogus and was put in place so they (Viking folks) can contact the little, grey, Roswell-looking men after they mature out of the religion to see aliens' true form instead of a Viking dude. BTW, Thor was voiced by Michael Shanks, who mainly portrayed Daniel Jackson.
- mindslight 5y ago
  People like myths. They generally don't like atheism because it's basically just rejecting their favorite myth, without even having one of its own [0]. Thus I believe a non-atheist watching the show is likely to see a bunch of other stories, which while false are actually more in line with their worldview than not. They aren't going to latch onto the general implication of if all these stories about Gods are false, maybe theirs is too. There are already plenty of competing religions, and they rarely induce this effect. [0] I feel bad about saying this, because the rationalist story of emergent creation is quite amazing. But for most people grokking complex details is not enjoyable.
delecti 5y ago
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the tech jumping the shark with the Prometheus. They handled pretty well how they were very much a small fish in a big pond. As for the device in "Fifth Race" and "Point of View", it burned itself out, making it not very practical except in rare situations. It's totally a fair criticism to say that there are some pretty contrived reasons to keep their power generation limited (across all three series really), but I give them credit because at least they gave a reason rather than just forgetting it like many episodic SFF.
naasking 5y ago
> The tech jumped the shark at the start of season 5 with the introduction of Prometheus Agreed, the tech development timeline was way too fast starting with the Prometheus. Progress up to that point was a little more plausible. I also never understood why they didn't come up with their own energy weapons. Those were the first things they started collecting, so they should have been able to replicate them given how other tech progressed. And who builds starships before they can build simple weapons? Sure bullets were more accurate according to canon, but having a lightweight and inexhaustible weapon is also invaluable, so putting some effort into improving the accuracy of the energy weapons seems like a no-brainer. Never made sense to me, but a fun show regardless.
- laumars 5y ago
  That was addressed in the show. The Prometheus used a retrofitted Asgard hyperdrive however the Asgards didn’t provide them with any tech to build weapons (at least until the very last episode in SG1). You do see Earth building energy weapons based on Zat'nik'tel which was used for training exercises after SG1 scavenged the same devices from a Goa'uld camp who fashioned those same training guns that appeared like Earth weapons but were Zat-based. However those wouldn’t have worked on a larger scale (ship to ship). They do also address in one episode why SG teams prefer their guns over the Jaffa’s energy weapons (the argument given was “accuracy”).
  - naasking 5y ago
    > The Prometheus used a retrofitted Asgard hyperdrive however the Asgards didn’t provide them with any tech to build weapons (at least until the very last episode in SG1). That doesn't explain why they didn't develop their own long before then. They could reverse engineer the tech and materials science for fighters and spaceships but not energy weapons? Come on. > They do also address in one episode why SG teams prefer their guns over the Jaffa’s energy weapons (the argument given was “accuracy”). Yes, and I addressed that point in the post you replied to (see "sure bullets were more accurate according to canon"). In reality, energy weapons would have been included in standard kit simply because they don't run out of ammo. SG teams are potentially out for long deployments, how much ammo do you think they could carry with them? It's simply implausible that they would not have prioritized developing their own energy weapons with an eye towards making them more accurate, rather than simply throwing their hands up and saying "bullets are more accurate". By canon logic, the staffs were weapons of terror and intimidation and not designed for war, but that doesn't mean a better design suited to combat wasn't possible.
laumars 5y ago
> The tech jumped the shark at the start of season 5 with the introduction of Prometheus Prometheus was very much portrayed as a kludge that barely held together for quite a few episodes after it was built. It wasn’t until the Asgards helped with development that it started to look anything like a functional spaceship. > I wouldn't call it fundamentally atheist either, in fact the entire thing was about religion, especially the last two seasons. It was about liberating cultures from worshiping gods. O’Neill is very much anti-religion in his comments throughout the show. And the Ori are as close to the definition of a “god” as one might get and there were 2 series and a movie dedicated to making a point that no entity should be worshipped regardless of how powerful they might be. They even feature references to Earth religions and “disprove” they’re credibility (albeit it doesn’t touch the Abrahamic religions but that might have been a step too far for an American network). That’s about as anti-religion as one can get and like the GP I was really surprised an American network was allowed to finance it.
Izkata 5y ago
> but things like the device built in the "Fifth Race" episode, it could open a wormhole to another galaxy, it was used in one more episode "Point of View", then conveniently forgotten about. I think it was mentioned once more, one of the scientists said afterwards it broke down they still couldn't figure it out and fix it. That device was Ancient technology after all, not Asgard or anything else. Also it didn't open the gate to another galaxy, the Stargate is capable of that all on its own. It amplified the energy output to juice of up the Stargate; come later seasons, once they found some ZPMs, they no longer needed it anyway.

walterbell 5y ago

> in fact the entire thing was about religion So many cosmology storylines about the role of tech as go(o)d proof, including: False gods (Goa'uld) Ascended Beings / Ancients Egyptian history (Ra, Osiris,..) Bio-mechanical-AI Lotan (S4E9, terraformer) Purgatory (semi-ascended, Oma Desala) Immaculate conception (Adria/Ori) Merlin, Grail, Arthurian legends Hallowed are the Ori Transhumanism (symbiotes, Ancient tech) Asgard cloning/transasgardism Asgard time-dilation & time-reversal Multiverses Multiple dimensions

flir 5y ago

Well religion, yes, absolutely, but behind every religion was a false God. (Dead false God). I'd call that implicitly athiest. By those last two seasons they're basically fighting mediaeval Christians. I don't think you can get much more obvious than that. There's only one "religion is good" story off the top of my head (when the Asgard are introduced as protectors of the Viking planet), and in that one the religion is meant to be outgrown (there's a test).

hericium 5y ago
> There's only one "religion is good" story off the top of my head (when the Asgard are introduced as protectors of the Viking planet), and in that one the religion is meant to be outgrown. Great example. It pointed out that religion/mythology is bogus and was put in place so they (Viking folks) can contact the little, grey, Roswell-looking men after they mature out of the religion to see aliens' true form instead of a Viking dude. BTW, Thor was voiced by Michael Shanks, who mainly portrayed Daniel Jackson.
mindslight 5y ago
People like myths. They generally don't like atheism because it's basically just rejecting their favorite myth, without even having one of its own [0]. Thus I believe a non-atheist watching the show is likely to see a bunch of other stories, which while false are actually more in line with their worldview than not. They aren't going to latch onto the general implication of if all these stories about Gods are false, maybe theirs is too. There are already plenty of competing religions, and they rarely induce this effect. [0] I feel bad about saying this, because the rationalist story of emergent creation is quite amazing. But for most people grokking complex details is not enjoyable.

delecti 5y ago

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the tech jumping the shark with the Prometheus. They handled pretty well how they were very much a small fish in a big pond. As for the device in "Fifth Race" and "Point of View", it burned itself out, making it not very practical except in rare situations. It's totally a fair criticism to say that there are some pretty contrived reasons to keep their power generation limited (across all three series really), but I give them credit because at least they gave a reason rather than just forgetting it like many episodic SFF.

naasking 5y ago

> The tech jumped the shark at the start of season 5 with the introduction of Prometheus Agreed, the tech development timeline was way too fast starting with the Prometheus. Progress up to that point was a little more plausible. I also never understood why they didn't come up with their own energy weapons. Those were the first things they started collecting, so they should have been able to replicate them given how other tech progressed. And who builds starships before they can build simple weapons? Sure bullets were more accurate according to canon, but having a lightweight and inexhaustible weapon is also invaluable, so putting some effort into improving the accuracy of the energy weapons seems like a no-brainer. Never made sense to me, but a fun show regardless.

laumars 5y ago
That was addressed in the show. The Prometheus used a retrofitted Asgard hyperdrive however the Asgards didn’t provide them with any tech to build weapons (at least until the very last episode in SG1). You do see Earth building energy weapons based on Zat'nik'tel which was used for training exercises after SG1 scavenged the same devices from a Goa'uld camp who fashioned those same training guns that appeared like Earth weapons but were Zat-based. However those wouldn’t have worked on a larger scale (ship to ship). They do also address in one episode why SG teams prefer their guns over the Jaffa’s energy weapons (the argument given was “accuracy”).
- naasking 5y ago
  > The Prometheus used a retrofitted Asgard hyperdrive however the Asgards didn’t provide them with any tech to build weapons (at least until the very last episode in SG1). That doesn't explain why they didn't develop their own long before then. They could reverse engineer the tech and materials science for fighters and spaceships but not energy weapons? Come on. > They do also address in one episode why SG teams prefer their guns over the Jaffa’s energy weapons (the argument given was “accuracy”). Yes, and I addressed that point in the post you replied to (see "sure bullets were more accurate according to canon"). In reality, energy weapons would have been included in standard kit simply because they don't run out of ammo. SG teams are potentially out for long deployments, how much ammo do you think they could carry with them? It's simply implausible that they would not have prioritized developing their own energy weapons with an eye towards making them more accurate, rather than simply throwing their hands up and saying "bullets are more accurate". By canon logic, the staffs were weapons of terror and intimidation and not designed for war, but that doesn't mean a better design suited to combat wasn't possible.

laumars 5y ago

> The tech jumped the shark at the start of season 5 with the introduction of Prometheus Prometheus was very much portrayed as a kludge that barely held together for quite a few episodes after it was built. It wasn’t until the Asgards helped with development that it started to look anything like a functional spaceship. > I wouldn't call it fundamentally atheist either, in fact the entire thing was about religion, especially the last two seasons. It was about liberating cultures from worshiping gods. O’Neill is very much anti-religion in his comments throughout the show. And the Ori are as close to the definition of a “god” as one might get and there were 2 series and a movie dedicated to making a point that no entity should be worshipped regardless of how powerful they might be. They even feature references to Earth religions and “disprove” they’re credibility (albeit it doesn’t touch the Abrahamic religions but that might have been a step too far for an American network). That’s about as anti-religion as one can get and like the GP I was really surprised an American network was allowed to finance it.

Izkata 5y ago

> but things like the device built in the "Fifth Race" episode, it could open a wormhole to another galaxy, it was used in one more episode "Point of View", then conveniently forgotten about. I think it was mentioned once more, one of the scientists said afterwards it broke down they still couldn't figure it out and fix it. That device was Ancient technology after all, not Asgard or anything else. Also it didn't open the gate to another galaxy, the Stargate is capable of that all on its own. It amplified the energy output to juice of up the Stargate; come later seasons, once they found some ZPMs, they no longer needed it anyway.