3 ms·

The police are allowed to lie to you (non-crime). You aren't allowed to lie to them (crime). This isn't news.

by notch656a 5y ago

salawat 5y ago
Maybe not to you, but there are a lot of youth who never get filled in on that fact.
friendlydog 5y ago
"and in at least one instance, a forged report was presented to a court as evidence" perjury is absolutely news.
- ttfkam 5y ago
  The number of cops testifying on the stand who are never charged with perjury would likely astound you. And the number of submitted police reports that clearly contradict reality.
  - notch656a 5y ago
    There's a great netflix special about the drug lab in Massachussets. One lady was just straight up not testing samples at all, and marking them positive for the prosecution. Thousands were jailed this way. The chemist was only caught because her work was 4x as fast as her coworkers, so they investigated what was going on. Now imagine how many smarter people than her just ran all the tests at normal speed, but faked the result. It'd be damn near impossible for them to get caught. I'd wager for every one caught, there are 10 that don't.
    - ashwagary 5y ago
jjulius 5y ago
That disparity may not be news, but perhaps it is worth discussing.
nocturnial 5y ago
This might be true in the US but in some other countries the police aren't allowed to lie.
- refurb 5y ago
  Which countries? Canada: Yes Australia: Yes UK: looks like cant lie about evidence?
  - nocturnial 5y ago
    It's not allowed in the Netherlands and Belgium. I thought it also wasn't allowed in the other european countries but I'm not a 100% sure about that. If the police are allowed to lie about evidence then this undermines the suspects chances for a fair trial (false confession). If the defense can show at a trial that the police lied during the interrogation, this would impact the chance for a conviction. At least this is how it works in the EU. In the US, I have the impression the judges don't take this into account.
- rPlayer6554 5y ago
  In some other countries the police are allowed to use physical force during interrogations. So what is your point?
  - scotty79 5y ago
    Maybe the point is they don't need to be allowed that snd maybe they shouldn't be allowed that?
    - rPlayer6554 5y ago
      Then the user should say that and state their argument, no?
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
avidiax 5y ago
The distinction here is that this lie is so coercive that it's unethical to allow any confession or evidence following it. What would you do if you don't have money for a lawyer, and the police say that your unassailable DNA evidence was found on a now-dead acquaintance of yours, and your options are confess to the murder and get 10 years with opportunity for parole, or fight and get life? Even if you knew that the police can lie, know you are innocent but can't prove it, and you believe that the DNA test is real or the police are willing to fake it, you might confess b/c that's the best option.
physicsyogi 5y ago
Lying to local (and state?) police is legal (I think). Lying to federal LEOs is a crime.

The police are allowed to lie to you (non-crime). You aren't allowed to lie to them (crime). This isn't news.

salawat 5y ago

Maybe not to you, but there are a lot of youth who never get filled in on that fact.

friendlydog 5y ago

"and in at least one instance, a forged report was presented to a court as evidence" perjury is absolutely news.

ttfkam 5y ago
The number of cops testifying on the stand who are never charged with perjury would likely astound you. And the number of submitted police reports that clearly contradict reality.
- notch656a 5y ago
  There's a great netflix special about the drug lab in Massachussets. One lady was just straight up not testing samples at all, and marking them positive for the prosecution. Thousands were jailed this way. The chemist was only caught because her work was 4x as fast as her coworkers, so they investigated what was going on. Now imagine how many smarter people than her just ran all the tests at normal speed, but faked the result. It'd be damn near impossible for them to get caught. I'd wager for every one caught, there are 10 that don't.
  - ashwagary 5y ago

jjulius 5y ago

That disparity may not be news, but perhaps it is worth discussing.

nocturnial 5y ago

This might be true in the US but in some other countries the police aren't allowed to lie.

refurb 5y ago
Which countries? Canada: Yes Australia: Yes UK: looks like cant lie about evidence?
- nocturnial 5y ago
  It's not allowed in the Netherlands and Belgium. I thought it also wasn't allowed in the other european countries but I'm not a 100% sure about that. If the police are allowed to lie about evidence then this undermines the suspects chances for a fair trial (false confession). If the defense can show at a trial that the police lied during the interrogation, this would impact the chance for a conviction. At least this is how it works in the EU. In the US, I have the impression the judges don't take this into account.
rPlayer6554 5y ago
In some other countries the police are allowed to use physical force during interrogations. So what is your point?
- scotty79 5y ago
  Maybe the point is they don't need to be allowed that snd maybe they shouldn't be allowed that?
  - rPlayer6554 5y ago
    Then the user should say that and state their argument, no?
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]

avidiax 5y ago

The distinction here is that this lie is so coercive that it's unethical to allow any confession or evidence following it. What would you do if you don't have money for a lawyer, and the police say that your unassailable DNA evidence was found on a now-dead acquaintance of yours, and your options are confess to the murder and get 10 years with opportunity for parole, or fight and get life? Even if you knew that the police can lie, know you are innocent but can't prove it, and you believe that the DNA test is real or the police are willing to fake it, you might confess b/c that's the best option.

physicsyogi 5y ago

Lying to local (and state?) police is legal (I think). Lying to federal LEOs is a crime.