5 ms·

From the beginning it has been obvious that the decision makers did not know what to do about this pandemic. I am not convinced that lockdowns and masks have de

From the beginning it has been obvious that the decision makers did not know what to do about this pandemic. I am not convinced that lockdowns and masks have decreased the positive cases based on comparisons between places that were heavy on lockdown and mask mandates and those that weren’t. Almost no one is wearing N95 masks. And many of those who wear masks only wear them some of the time or incorrectly. On a flight I took recently, they asked a man to remove his N99 mask in favor of the standard issue, light blue surgical mask you see everywhere. Masks to me are symbolic. People wear them to show that they care and that want to obey the pleas to “do your part”. But with the implementation I’ve seen they probably haven’t helped much.

kspacewalk2 5y ago
Masks are our "doing our part" symbols, the Covid ribbon if you will. The science on anything other than N95 masks is flimsy, but it's low-effort and low-cost, so why not. It feels like better than nothing, it probably is, so we go along with it.
- ars 5y ago
  It's basically the same as the security theater at the airport - it makes you feel like you have control over something you don't actually control.
  - MrMan 5y ago
    its all the diseases besides Covid that masking helps. I think its great from a public health POV, despite being a bit annoying.
- TaylorAlexander 5y ago
  Is the science flimsy? I genuinely thought that the science was very clear that good masking reduces the rate of community transmission?
  - miles 5y ago
    The large study from Bangladesh last year[0] which was widely trumpeted with headlines like "Large Study Confirms Masks Work to Limit COVID-19 Spread"[1], averred that, "Villages where cloth masks were distributed experienced a 9 percent reduction in symptoms, while villages where surgical masks were distributed saw a reduction of 12 percent." Stanford Medicine's assessment[2] states that, "Although there were also fewer COVID-19 cases in villages with cloth masks as compared to control villages, the difference was not statistically significant." [0] https://www.poverty-action.org/study/impact-mask-distribution-and-promotion-mask-uptake-and-covid-19-bangladesh https://www.poverty-action.org/study/impact-mask-distributio... [1] https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210907/masks-limit-covid-spread-study https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210907/masks-limit-covid-s... [2] https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2021/09/surgical-masks-covid-19.html https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2021/09/surgical-mask...
    - hedgehog 5y ago
      To put those in context, what the study did was promote masks across a bunch of villages. Some people across all arms of the study were already wearing masks of various sorts, so the data should be read as the combined effect of: the promotion changing behavior, people starting to use masks or replacing their existing ones, and then the net effect on transmission. So the % effectiveness quoted is the effectiveness of the new masks relative to whatever people were already doing watered down by how much putting up posters etc actually changes human behavior. Pretty remarkable actually.
    - kyrra 5y ago
      There are some critiques of the Bangladesh study, you can read some here: https://mobile.twitter.com/Emily_Burns_V/status/1433122124768714753?s=20 https://mobile.twitter.com/Emily_Burns_V/status/143312212476... One big issue was that the mask pickup didn't equally reduce cases across ages. This leads to the training for wearing masks may have caused older groups to stop socializing, rather than the masks doing anything.
  - daveevad 5y ago
    One of the very first studies posted to the CDC website about mask efficacy, "Absence of Apparent Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 from Two Stylists After Exposure at a Hair Salon with a Universal Face Covering Policy — Springfield, Missouri, May 2020," appeared to indicate masks were overwhelmingly effective. The success of this study has not been replicated to my knowledge. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6928e2.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6928e2.htm > Among 139 clients exposed to two symptomatic hair stylists with confirmed COVID-19 while both the stylists and the clients wore face masks, no symptomatic secondary cases were reported; among 67 clients tested for SARS-CoV-2, all test results were negative. Adherence to the community’s and company’s face-covering policy likely mitigated spread of SARS-CoV-2.
mdns33 5y ago
fortran77 5y ago
I've been on several flights during the pandemic where someone on the plane was using a CPAP in-flight. This is allowed, even though CPAP's have been shown to aerosolize and spread viruses. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7298691/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7298691/ I have raised this issue with everyone I could think of and nobody cares, or is willing to tell CPAP users they can't fly. This proves to me that the people in charge don't care about reducing COVID exposure. I do wear properly-fitted genuine N95s while flying and have never had any flight staff tell me I couldn't.
dmix 5y ago
> they asked a man to remove his N99 mask in favor of the standard issue, light blue surgical mask you see everywhere. They do this at a hospital I go to frequently (require a blue surgical mask uniformly) and I just put the blue surgical mask on top. Havent had any breathing problems or anything. The blue ones are pretty thing and useless in that state. All they care about is following protocol, not efficacy.

kspacewalk2 5y ago

Masks are our "doing our part" symbols, the Covid ribbon if you will. The science on anything other than N95 masks is flimsy, but it's low-effort and low-cost, so why not. It feels like better than nothing, it probably is, so we go along with it.

ars 5y ago
It's basically the same as the security theater at the airport - it makes you feel like you have control over something you don't actually control.
- MrMan 5y ago
  its all the diseases besides Covid that masking helps. I think its great from a public health POV, despite being a bit annoying.
TaylorAlexander 5y ago
Is the science flimsy? I genuinely thought that the science was very clear that good masking reduces the rate of community transmission?
- miles 5y ago
  The large study from Bangladesh last year[0] which was widely trumpeted with headlines like "Large Study Confirms Masks Work to Limit COVID-19 Spread"[1], averred that, "Villages where cloth masks were distributed experienced a 9 percent reduction in symptoms, while villages where surgical masks were distributed saw a reduction of 12 percent." Stanford Medicine's assessment[2] states that, "Although there were also fewer COVID-19 cases in villages with cloth masks as compared to control villages, the difference was not statistically significant." [0] https://www.poverty-action.org/study/impact-mask-distribution-and-promotion-mask-uptake-and-covid-19-bangladesh https://www.poverty-action.org/study/impact-mask-distributio... [1] https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210907/masks-limit-covid-spread-study https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210907/masks-limit-covid-s... [2] https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2021/09/surgical-masks-covid-19.html https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2021/09/surgical-mask...
  - hedgehog 5y ago
    To put those in context, what the study did was promote masks across a bunch of villages. Some people across all arms of the study were already wearing masks of various sorts, so the data should be read as the combined effect of: the promotion changing behavior, people starting to use masks or replacing their existing ones, and then the net effect on transmission. So the % effectiveness quoted is the effectiveness of the new masks relative to whatever people were already doing watered down by how much putting up posters etc actually changes human behavior. Pretty remarkable actually.
  - kyrra 5y ago
    There are some critiques of the Bangladesh study, you can read some here: https://mobile.twitter.com/Emily_Burns_V/status/1433122124768714753?s=20 https://mobile.twitter.com/Emily_Burns_V/status/143312212476... One big issue was that the mask pickup didn't equally reduce cases across ages. This leads to the training for wearing masks may have caused older groups to stop socializing, rather than the masks doing anything.
- daveevad 5y ago
  One of the very first studies posted to the CDC website about mask efficacy, "Absence of Apparent Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 from Two Stylists After Exposure at a Hair Salon with a Universal Face Covering Policy — Springfield, Missouri, May 2020," appeared to indicate masks were overwhelmingly effective. The success of this study has not been replicated to my knowledge. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6928e2.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6928e2.htm > Among 139 clients exposed to two symptomatic hair stylists with confirmed COVID-19 while both the stylists and the clients wore face masks, no symptomatic secondary cases were reported; among 67 clients tested for SARS-CoV-2, all test results were negative. Adherence to the community’s and company’s face-covering policy likely mitigated spread of SARS-CoV-2.

mdns33 5y ago

fortran77 5y ago

I've been on several flights during the pandemic where someone on the plane was using a CPAP in-flight. This is allowed, even though CPAP's have been shown to aerosolize and spread viruses. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7298691/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7298691/ I have raised this issue with everyone I could think of and nobody cares, or is willing to tell CPAP users they can't fly. This proves to me that the people in charge don't care about reducing COVID exposure. I do wear properly-fitted genuine N95s while flying and have never had any flight staff tell me I couldn't.

dmix 5y ago

> they asked a man to remove his N99 mask in favor of the standard issue, light blue surgical mask you see everywhere. They do this at a hospital I go to frequently (require a blue surgical mask uniformly) and I just put the blue surgical mask on top. Havent had any breathing problems or anything. The blue ones are pretty thing and useless in that state. All they care about is following protocol, not efficacy.