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Even more realistically, the payout from workman’s comp is unattainable for most people because of the amount of time and money you have to invest (you will nee

Even more realistically, the payout from workman’s comp is unattainable for most people because of the amount of time and money you have to invest (you will need a lawyer fighting the company for years).

Maursault 5y ago
This is simply not true. You make it sound like it's some part of the justice system, and it simply isn't in the US. The Department of Labor operates within the Executive Branch. There is no trial. There is no burden of proof on whomever files the application, though likely a threat of perjury if untruthful. If someone dies at work, workers compensation is automatic... there is no way to lose it nor be denied if a survivor applies. It probably takes a few months, but it isn't dragged out for years. If injured, I think the entitlement for injury at the workplace is about 10 years, and if permanently disabled then entitled to lost wage benefits until death (i.e. not just until retirement). I don't know what you're thinking of, but it isn't workers comp. That always gets paid without a fight.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > I don't know what you're thinking of, but it isn't workers comp. That always gets paid without a fight. No, it doesn't, which is why workers comp lawyers exist. Disputes occur over all of: * was there a covered event * whether particular injuries were due to the event * whether particular interventions are medically appropriate * Whether, and the extent to which, disability remains when the employee has achieved their permanent and stable level of recovery.
  - Maursault 5y ago
    Workers comp for death is always paid without any dispute. There isn't even a hearing. There is no such thing as "workers comp law," so even though they advertise as such, there's no such thing as a "workers comp lawyer." They're personal injury lawyers, personal injury being a type of civil law. If an insurance company refuses a claim, there is a right to appeal. That's a hearing before a judge or mediator. If won, and the insurance company still doesn't pay, your personal injury lawyer will file a personal injury lawsuit on your behalf. Did you read the thread? OP believes it's a conspiracy. There's no conspiracy, only bureaucracy. If a claim is denied, it will most likely be because there is a problem with the application, i.e. an error made by the applicant, and not because employers and their insurance companies have teams of high powered attorneys that all day every day work to make sure no one gets paid workers comp. That's ridiculous. The fact of the matter is that only 7% of workers comp claims are denied. Only 5% get to an appeal hearing, and only a tiny fraction resolve in lawsuit. 93% of all workers comp claims are accepted outright without a fight.
    - dragonwriter 5y ago
      > Workers comp for death is always paid without any dispute. No, it's not. Workers comp for death at work might be, because it's open and shut, but workers comp for death caused by work is as often disputed as any other work-caused injury. > There is no such thing as "workers comp law," so even though they advertise as such, there's no such thing as a "workers comp lawyer." There is distinct law and legal process around workers comp, and there are lawyers that build their practice around it because their is a sufficient body of disputes to make that worthwhile. Yes, it's a subset of personal injury law, as workers compensation systems are themselves an outgrowth of one particular liability rule in personal injury law. > OP believes it's a conspiracy That's nice. Neither that, nor its negation, is the claim I took issue with.
      - Maursault 5y ago
        > No, it's not. Yes it is. If there's a body, and a claim, unless it is an act of God, there is never any dispute. In these cases, payment is automatic. There may be a separate lawsuit for unlawful death or pain and suffering or anything under the sun, but the workers comp claim is automatically approved and paid. > There is distinct law and legal process around workers comp... What you're talking about is convention. Convention is not law, it is merely an arbitrarily adopted process. This is not a subset of personal injury law, it is personal injury law. > the claim I took issue with. Let's get back to the statistics (which obliterate your objection): only 7% of workers comp claims are denied. Only 5% get to an appeal hearing, and only a tiny fraction resolve in lawsuit. 93% of all workers comp claims are accepted outright without a fight. If 93% of all claims are accepted outright, then the notion that workers comp lawyers exist means there's always, often, or usually a fight (oops, missed your fallacy assuming the conclusion) is false. In fact, the verifiable truth is nearly all claims are accepted and paid without dispute, as 93% is nearly all. Disagree all you wish, it is your right, but you will continue to be mistaken.
        dragonwriter 5y ago
        > If 93% of all claims are accepted outright, then the notion that workers comp lawyers exist means there's always, often, or usually a fight ... is false. True, but I didn't claim that. I did state that the claim you made that “workers comp ... always gets paid without a fight” is false, which it is, and your stats show that clearly.
  - dataangel 5y ago
    I am thinking of workers comp. Both my parents tried to get it and failed because of the legal shenanigans. One of my parents was injured in front of a live audience and still couldn't get it. Even better, they were told if the began treatment before approval then it would not be covered even if they were subsequently approved, and many injuries your recovery is better the sooner treatment is started.

Maursault 5y ago

This is simply not true. You make it sound like it's some part of the justice system, and it simply isn't in the US. The Department of Labor operates within the Executive Branch. There is no trial. There is no burden of proof on whomever files the application, though likely a threat of perjury if untruthful. If someone dies at work, workers compensation is automatic... there is no way to lose it nor be denied if a survivor applies. It probably takes a few months, but it isn't dragged out for years. If injured, I think the entitlement for injury at the workplace is about 10 years, and if permanently disabled then entitled to lost wage benefits until death (i.e. not just until retirement). I don't know what you're thinking of, but it isn't workers comp. That always gets paid without a fight.

dragonwriter 5y ago
> I don't know what you're thinking of, but it isn't workers comp. That always gets paid without a fight. No, it doesn't, which is why workers comp lawyers exist. Disputes occur over all of: * was there a covered event * whether particular injuries were due to the event * whether particular interventions are medically appropriate * Whether, and the extent to which, disability remains when the employee has achieved their permanent and stable level of recovery.
- Maursault 5y ago
  Workers comp for death is always paid without any dispute. There isn't even a hearing. There is no such thing as "workers comp law," so even though they advertise as such, there's no such thing as a "workers comp lawyer." They're personal injury lawyers, personal injury being a type of civil law. If an insurance company refuses a claim, there is a right to appeal. That's a hearing before a judge or mediator. If won, and the insurance company still doesn't pay, your personal injury lawyer will file a personal injury lawsuit on your behalf. Did you read the thread? OP believes it's a conspiracy. There's no conspiracy, only bureaucracy. If a claim is denied, it will most likely be because there is a problem with the application, i.e. an error made by the applicant, and not because employers and their insurance companies have teams of high powered attorneys that all day every day work to make sure no one gets paid workers comp. That's ridiculous. The fact of the matter is that only 7% of workers comp claims are denied. Only 5% get to an appeal hearing, and only a tiny fraction resolve in lawsuit. 93% of all workers comp claims are accepted outright without a fight.
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    > Workers comp for death is always paid without any dispute. No, it's not. Workers comp for death at work might be, because it's open and shut, but workers comp for death caused by work is as often disputed as any other work-caused injury. > There is no such thing as "workers comp law," so even though they advertise as such, there's no such thing as a "workers comp lawyer." There is distinct law and legal process around workers comp, and there are lawyers that build their practice around it because their is a sufficient body of disputes to make that worthwhile. Yes, it's a subset of personal injury law, as workers compensation systems are themselves an outgrowth of one particular liability rule in personal injury law. > OP believes it's a conspiracy That's nice. Neither that, nor its negation, is the claim I took issue with.
    - Maursault 5y ago
      > No, it's not. Yes it is. If there's a body, and a claim, unless it is an act of God, there is never any dispute. In these cases, payment is automatic. There may be a separate lawsuit for unlawful death or pain and suffering or anything under the sun, but the workers comp claim is automatically approved and paid. > There is distinct law and legal process around workers comp... What you're talking about is convention. Convention is not law, it is merely an arbitrarily adopted process. This is not a subset of personal injury law, it is personal injury law. > the claim I took issue with. Let's get back to the statistics (which obliterate your objection): only 7% of workers comp claims are denied. Only 5% get to an appeal hearing, and only a tiny fraction resolve in lawsuit. 93% of all workers comp claims are accepted outright without a fight. If 93% of all claims are accepted outright, then the notion that workers comp lawyers exist means there's always, often, or usually a fight (oops, missed your fallacy assuming the conclusion) is false. In fact, the verifiable truth is nearly all claims are accepted and paid without dispute, as 93% is nearly all. Disagree all you wish, it is your right, but you will continue to be mistaken.
      - dragonwriter 5y ago
        > If 93% of all claims are accepted outright, then the notion that workers comp lawyers exist means there's always, often, or usually a fight ... is false. True, but I didn't claim that. I did state that the claim you made that “workers comp ... always gets paid without a fight” is false, which it is, and your stats show that clearly.
- dataangel 5y ago
  I am thinking of workers comp. Both my parents tried to get it and failed because of the legal shenanigans. One of my parents was injured in front of a live audience and still couldn't get it. Even better, they were told if the began treatment before approval then it would not be covered even if they were subsequently approved, and many injuries your recovery is better the sooner treatment is started.