4 ms·

The train robberies and breakdown of civil order in CA remind me of Atlas Shrugged much more than Snow Crash.

by javert 5y ago

nefitty 5y ago
I'm not really clear on why people are surprised about these thefts. Isn't train robbery a western film trope? Maybe we've culturally forgotten trains, but they're the mitochondria, the powerhouse of the cell. Train chicanery was even an integral part of the civil war.
- w0de0 5y ago
  In America, the train hasn't been that vital to infrastructure since the era that inspired the trope. Trucks move 7 times more value annually [https://www.bts.gov/newsroom/2017-north-american-freight-numbers https://www.bts.gov/newsroom/2017-north-american-freight-num...].
  - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
    Frieght rail carries a stupid amount of goods. If you use a carrier like Hub Group or JB Hunt to ship containers cross country odds are the bulk of the mileage is on rail. This is doubly true for bulk goods. Nobody is hauling bulk goods very far by truck. If you live in a major urban area you'd never see it though because the intermodal facilities tend to be at or beyond the beltway (more efficient to truck the last 20-100mi).
  - Symbiote 5y ago
    Trains absolutely are vital, unless you think 2,500,000 tonne-km could be added to the highways -- already carrying 3,000,000 tonne-km [1]. Trains also do that with only 10% of the fuel [2]. I'm not sure what the table you link is showing. Is it $-km, or $-journeys? [1] https://www.bts.gov/us-tonne-kilometers-freight https://www.bts.gov/us-tonne-kilometers-freight [2] https://www.bts.gov/content/fuel-consumption-mode-transportation https://www.bts.gov/content/fuel-consumption-mode-transporta...
  - jatone 5y ago
    that's because the majority of economic activity are near ports where train wouldn't be as useful. as a result the bulk of goods transported by train are to the lower populated areas where again the last mile is done by truck. doesn't make trains not vital.
w0de0 5y ago
A manifesto pretending (lazily) to be a novel, Atlas Shrugged is a sophomoric work of prescriptive pretension, not the type which observes and reports in verisimilitude a plausible description of human affairs. In short your comment is an insight to you, and only an insight to California in as much as one accepts Objectivism as a thoughtful (haha! is my opinion) framework for grokking reality.
- onphonenow 5y ago
  "a sophomoric work of prescriptive pretension, not the type which observes and reports in verisimilitude a plausible description of human affairs." Huh? Isn't the literal plot of Atlas Shrugged trains being looted? Govt not preventing issues? Not sure the sophomoric work has to "reports in verisimilitude a plausible description of human affairs" to remind someone of a parallel? The book itself sold 9M copies I think. I personally couldn't get through it as it's not my style particularly, but I could see how someone would find a parallel.
- drjasonharrison 5y ago
  Well Snow Crash describes a world with VR where a "visual stimulus" can lock people into their own heads, or make them slaves to an over mind. There might have been an "auditory stimulus" too... Based on summaries of Atlas Shrugged, I believe that it describes a world in which real physical objects and locations are targeted for theft and destruction. So your comment is a bit aggressively personal.
  - DrBoring 5y ago
    I too found the response to Atlas Shrugged comment to be oddly agressive. I always find it curious whenever people hate on the book. I want to ask, what about the book was so offensive? I would summarize the story of Atlas Shrugged as the collapse of USA caused by an incompetent government whose policies rob and persecute the productive industrialists who have the competency to keep the country infrastructure going. One of the protagonists runs a railroad company. I don't think there was actually any train robbing, but towards the end of the downfall, gangs were extorting money to let her trains enter and exit stations. I can't remember much from Snow Crash, read it too long ago. I think one protagonist was a courier, and the book took place in a distopian future.

The train robberies and breakdown of civil order in CA remind me of Atlas Shrugged much more than Snow Crash.

by javert 5y ago

The train robberies and breakdown of civil order in CA remind me of Atlas Shrugged much more than Snow Crash.

I'm not really clear on why people are surprised about these thefts. Isn't train robbery a western film trope? Maybe we've culturally forgotten trains, but they're the mitochondria, the powerhouse of the cell. Train chicanery was even an integral part of the civil war.

w0de0 5y ago
In America, the train hasn't been that vital to infrastructure since the era that inspired the trope. Trucks move 7 times more value annually [https://www.bts.gov/newsroom/2017-north-american-freight-numbers https://www.bts.gov/newsroom/2017-north-american-freight-num...].
- throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  Frieght rail carries a stupid amount of goods. If you use a carrier like Hub Group or JB Hunt to ship containers cross country odds are the bulk of the mileage is on rail. This is doubly true for bulk goods. Nobody is hauling bulk goods very far by truck. If you live in a major urban area you'd never see it though because the intermodal facilities tend to be at or beyond the beltway (more efficient to truck the last 20-100mi).
- Symbiote 5y ago
  Trains absolutely are vital, unless you think 2,500,000 tonne-km could be added to the highways -- already carrying 3,000,000 tonne-km [1]. Trains also do that with only 10% of the fuel [2]. I'm not sure what the table you link is showing. Is it $-km, or $-journeys? [1] https://www.bts.gov/us-tonne-kilometers-freight https://www.bts.gov/us-tonne-kilometers-freight [2] https://www.bts.gov/content/fuel-consumption-mode-transportation https://www.bts.gov/content/fuel-consumption-mode-transporta...
- jatone 5y ago
  that's because the majority of economic activity are near ports where train wouldn't be as useful. as a result the bulk of goods transported by train are to the lower populated areas where again the last mile is done by truck. doesn't make trains not vital.

w0de0 5y ago

A manifesto pretending (lazily) to be a novel, Atlas Shrugged is a sophomoric work of prescriptive pretension, not the type which observes and reports in verisimilitude a plausible description of human affairs. In short your comment is an insight to you, and only an insight to California in as much as one accepts Objectivism as a thoughtful (haha! is my opinion) framework for grokking reality.

onphonenow 5y ago
"a sophomoric work of prescriptive pretension, not the type which observes and reports in verisimilitude a plausible description of human affairs." Huh? Isn't the literal plot of Atlas Shrugged trains being looted? Govt not preventing issues? Not sure the sophomoric work has to "reports in verisimilitude a plausible description of human affairs" to remind someone of a parallel? The book itself sold 9M copies I think. I personally couldn't get through it as it's not my style particularly, but I could see how someone would find a parallel.
drjasonharrison 5y ago
Well Snow Crash describes a world with VR where a "visual stimulus" can lock people into their own heads, or make them slaves to an over mind. There might have been an "auditory stimulus" too... Based on summaries of Atlas Shrugged, I believe that it describes a world in which real physical objects and locations are targeted for theft and destruction. So your comment is a bit aggressively personal.
- DrBoring 5y ago
  I too found the response to Atlas Shrugged comment to be oddly agressive. I always find it curious whenever people hate on the book. I want to ask, what about the book was so offensive? I would summarize the story of Atlas Shrugged as the collapse of USA caused by an incompetent government whose policies rob and persecute the productive industrialists who have the competency to keep the country infrastructure going. One of the protagonists runs a railroad company. I don't think there was actually any train robbing, but towards the end of the downfall, gangs were extorting money to let her trains enter and exit stations. I can't remember much from Snow Crash, read it too long ago. I think one protagonist was a courier, and the book took place in a distopian future.