6 ms·

What are your ethical issues with Apple? Why mention them in the first place without further explication? Your other points rang true for me but this seems a li

by lukevp 5y ago

What are your ethical issues with Apple? Why mention them in the first place without further explication? Your other points rang true for me but this seems a little tangential.

pcdoodle 5y ago
For me it's the hostility towards developers and users. I can't even lower the dang contrast on my iOS or MacOS devices to make them a little less dopamine inducing. Sure you can switch to B&W but then I lose usability (Is that link clicked?). The massive cut they take from creators is another pain point. These are just off the top of my head, I'm sure others can chime in.
- zepto 5y ago
  The dopamine inducing element is addictive apps like Facebook, not the color levels of the display. You can simply delete the apps that have that effect.
  - pcdoodle 5y ago
    Tell that to my apple mail icon.
    - zepto 5y ago
      You can delete that if you don’t like it.
- mijkal 5y ago
  No doubt, Apple is more opinionated when it comes to UI/UX than others — for better or worse. It's a trade-off. Fwiw, Apple does provide more control over the display tucked away under Settings/System Preferences => Accessibility (lots of goodies there, actually). Not clear if you knew that and still found that too limiting, but perhaps others will have fun poking around in there. At least on the Mac, I can almost always find a third-party tool that can accomplish anything Apple didn't expose. I largely agree they need to reduce their App Store fees — it is damaging their goodwill for relatively limited benefit, but more-so it's attracting government scrutiny that will likely lead to worse outcomes for Apple and its users if they don't relent.
- zimpenfish 5y ago
  > I can't even lower the dang contrast on my iOS or MacOS devices Does "Reduce White Point" on iOS/iPadOS help at all? https://support.apple.com/en-by/guide/iphone/iph3e2e1fb0/ios https://support.apple.com/en-by/guide/iphone/iph3e2e1fb0/ios
horsawlarway 5y ago
> What are your ethical issues with Apple? I don't believe you can genuinely purchase an Apple phone at the moment, and I think they're trying pretty hard to move their laptop/desktop machines in the same direction. Namely - Much of their mobile ecosystem is utterly hostile towards non-Apple developers - including the owner of the device. They lock hardware/software features behind entitlements that require Apple's permission (and of course an accompanying fee) to use. Good luck using multicast on your personal device on your personal network. Turns out you can't. The hardware can, of course, but only if Apple allows it. In fact, turns out almost all of the software Apple provides to run their hardware treats you like a user, and not an owner. They riddle (and cripple) the product with digital locks, and do not provide the keys to the owner. Instead they provide keys only to apps submitted for review to their store, signed with their certs. So again, it's hard to say I actually own the damn thing.
- SavantIdiot 5y ago
  Is technological lock-in, or "hostility" toward a user as you put it, an ethical issue? I would think the use of Chinese labor abuses to make iPhones is the ethical issue. Funny you didn't mention that.
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    Wouldn’t be able to go with pretty much any one then. Probably wouldn’t be able to wear much of your clothing either if labor abuse is an issue.
    - SavantIdiot 5y ago
      Gustin and Everlane. These two clothing companies provide 100% transparency on their sourcing and labor practices. You absolutely can choose to wear clothing that doesn't enslave people. Maybe not 100% (shoes are still difficult to source), but it doesn't mean throwing your hands up and walking away. Or being cynical toward someone who is trying.
      - 5y ago

by lukevp 5y ago

What are your ethical issues with Apple? Why mention them in the first place without further explication? Your other points rang true for me but this seems a little tangential.

pcdoodle 5y ago

For me it's the hostility towards developers and users. I can't even lower the dang contrast on my iOS or MacOS devices to make them a little less dopamine inducing. Sure you can switch to B&W but then I lose usability (Is that link clicked?). The massive cut they take from creators is another pain point. These are just off the top of my head, I'm sure others can chime in.

zepto 5y ago
The dopamine inducing element is addictive apps like Facebook, not the color levels of the display. You can simply delete the apps that have that effect.
- pcdoodle 5y ago
  Tell that to my apple mail icon.
  - zepto 5y ago
    You can delete that if you don’t like it.
mijkal 5y ago
No doubt, Apple is more opinionated when it comes to UI/UX than others — for better or worse. It's a trade-off. Fwiw, Apple does provide more control over the display tucked away under Settings/System Preferences => Accessibility (lots of goodies there, actually). Not clear if you knew that and still found that too limiting, but perhaps others will have fun poking around in there. At least on the Mac, I can almost always find a third-party tool that can accomplish anything Apple didn't expose. I largely agree they need to reduce their App Store fees — it is damaging their goodwill for relatively limited benefit, but more-so it's attracting government scrutiny that will likely lead to worse outcomes for Apple and its users if they don't relent.
zimpenfish 5y ago
> I can't even lower the dang contrast on my iOS or MacOS devices Does "Reduce White Point" on iOS/iPadOS help at all? https://support.apple.com/en-by/guide/iphone/iph3e2e1fb0/ios https://support.apple.com/en-by/guide/iphone/iph3e2e1fb0/ios

horsawlarway 5y ago

> What are your ethical issues with Apple? I don't believe you can genuinely purchase an Apple phone at the moment, and I think they're trying pretty hard to move their laptop/desktop machines in the same direction. Namely - Much of their mobile ecosystem is utterly hostile towards non-Apple developers - including the owner of the device. They lock hardware/software features behind entitlements that require Apple's permission (and of course an accompanying fee) to use. Good luck using multicast on your personal device on your personal network. Turns out you can't. The hardware can, of course, but only if Apple allows it. In fact, turns out almost all of the software Apple provides to run their hardware treats you like a user, and not an owner. They riddle (and cripple) the product with digital locks, and do not provide the keys to the owner. Instead they provide keys only to apps submitted for review to their store, signed with their certs. So again, it's hard to say I actually own the damn thing.

SavantIdiot 5y ago
Is technological lock-in, or "hostility" toward a user as you put it, an ethical issue? I would think the use of Chinese labor abuses to make iPhones is the ethical issue. Funny you didn't mention that.
- skinnymuch 5y ago
  Wouldn’t be able to go with pretty much any one then. Probably wouldn’t be able to wear much of your clothing either if labor abuse is an issue.
  - SavantIdiot 5y ago
    Gustin and Everlane. These two clothing companies provide 100% transparency on their sourcing and labor practices. You absolutely can choose to wear clothing that doesn't enslave people. Maybe not 100% (shoes are still difficult to source), but it doesn't mean throwing your hands up and walking away. Or being cynical toward someone who is trying.
    - 5y ago