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> Responsibility for policing the railroad right of way falls on Union Pacific Police... not local agencies like LAPD So is 'Union Pacific Police' just a secur

> Responsibility for policing the railroad right of way falls on Union Pacific Police... not local agencies like LAPD So is 'Union Pacific Police' just a security company, or do you guys in the US actually have private businesses with their own police? Because that sounds pretty dystopian

PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
Recall, if you will, that the rail lines are privately owned here. So you have privately owned trains, running on privately owned tracks that are on privately owned land ... it's not entirely clear what the legal framework for government police authority to take effect here is, at least not if you're concerned about the wierdness that would result from just saying "interstate commerce, put the FBI on it".
JoeAltmaier 5y ago
Lots of grey areas. But transportation and commerce affect everybody, and because there's big ticket issues at risk it becomes a political and practical priority.
matt-attack 5y ago
Funny I thought usually things feel more dystopian when the government is the one exerting the force or control. In this case it’s your perception that government law enforcement is routine where as private security firms are dystopian?
unityByFreedom 5y ago
> Railroad police are certified state law enforcement officers with investigative and arrest powers both on and off railroad property in most states. They also have interstate law enforcement authority pursuant to federal law. > The railroad police force dates to the mid-1800s, when the number of U.S. Marshals was insufficient to police America's growing rail network. Members were called Pinkertons, named after their originator, Alan Pinkerton. Today, each Class I railroad employs Special Agents across the country to protect America’s rail network. https://www.up.com/aboutup/community/safety/special_agents/index.htm https://www.up.com/aboutup/community/safety/special_agents/i... It's just police who are probably paid by that business. That makes sense to me for a large business like this. If anything they're not doing a good enough job here.
- King-Aaron 5y ago
  Thanks for that. We have railroad police here in Australia as well, however it's all state government sponsored, I just hadn't heard of private enterprise funding police before.
  - unityByFreedom 5y ago
    We have them at colleges too. Sometimes you want full time real police who can send people to jail. I guess it depends on the environment and scale of crime to determine whether it's needed. If it is, then it may make sense to have the impacted business pay for it. Otherwise the city might not be able to commit enough resources.
dredmorbius 5y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police Railroads emerged at a time when the only significant national law-enforcement entity would have been the military or US Marshall's service. (There were some customs and coast guard operations, also the postal police dating to 1772, before the United States declared their independence from England.) Railroads operated across town or city, county, and state boundaries. They had a highly distinctive geography --- the linear alignment of tracks. And multi-jurisdictional law enforcement with competing interests would have been (and remains) problematic. So railroads provided (or contracted, often through the infamous Pinkerton Agency) their own security serivce. Many railroad police have full law-enforcement police and arrest powers. Note that there are other businesses and operations with some similar capabilities. A ship's captain traditionally had extraordinary powers when at sea, many hotels have or had house detectives, the US Postal Service as noted has its inspector service, and US Marshalls provide security aboard aircraft, though with partial coverage. Their presence and function received heightened awareness after the 9/11 attacks of 2001.
pmorici 5y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police#United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police#United_States
rdtsc 5y ago
Us and those wild Canadians up North too https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Pacific_Police_Service https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Pacific_Police_Serv.... It is crazy here, what can I tell ya ;-)
macinjosh 5y ago
A state run police force I am forced to pay for that has qualified immunity sounds a lot more dystopian to me than a private security firm a company hires to protect its business infrastructure.
LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_Patrol_Special_Police https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_Patrol_Special_P...

PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago

Recall, if you will, that the rail lines are privately owned here. So you have privately owned trains, running on privately owned tracks that are on privately owned land ... it's not entirely clear what the legal framework for government police authority to take effect here is, at least not if you're concerned about the wierdness that would result from just saying "interstate commerce, put the FBI on it".

JoeAltmaier 5y ago

Lots of grey areas. But transportation and commerce affect everybody, and because there's big ticket issues at risk it becomes a political and practical priority.

matt-attack 5y ago

Funny I thought usually things feel more dystopian when the government is the one exerting the force or control. In this case it’s your perception that government law enforcement is routine where as private security firms are dystopian?

unityByFreedom 5y ago

> Railroad police are certified state law enforcement officers with investigative and arrest powers both on and off railroad property in most states. They also have interstate law enforcement authority pursuant to federal law. > The railroad police force dates to the mid-1800s, when the number of U.S. Marshals was insufficient to police America's growing rail network. Members were called Pinkertons, named after their originator, Alan Pinkerton. Today, each Class I railroad employs Special Agents across the country to protect America’s rail network. https://www.up.com/aboutup/community/safety/special_agents/index.htm https://www.up.com/aboutup/community/safety/special_agents/i... It's just police who are probably paid by that business. That makes sense to me for a large business like this. If anything they're not doing a good enough job here.

King-Aaron 5y ago
Thanks for that. We have railroad police here in Australia as well, however it's all state government sponsored, I just hadn't heard of private enterprise funding police before.
- unityByFreedom 5y ago
  We have them at colleges too. Sometimes you want full time real police who can send people to jail. I guess it depends on the environment and scale of crime to determine whether it's needed. If it is, then it may make sense to have the impacted business pay for it. Otherwise the city might not be able to commit enough resources.

dredmorbius 5y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police Railroads emerged at a time when the only significant national law-enforcement entity would have been the military or US Marshall's service. (There were some customs and coast guard operations, also the postal police dating to 1772, before the United States declared their independence from England.) Railroads operated across town or city, county, and state boundaries. They had a highly distinctive geography --- the linear alignment of tracks. And multi-jurisdictional law enforcement with competing interests would have been (and remains) problematic. So railroads provided (or contracted, often through the infamous Pinkerton Agency) their own security serivce. Many railroad police have full law-enforcement police and arrest powers. Note that there are other businesses and operations with some similar capabilities. A ship's captain traditionally had extraordinary powers when at sea, many hotels have or had house detectives, the US Postal Service as noted has its inspector service, and US Marshalls provide security aboard aircraft, though with partial coverage. Their presence and function received heightened awareness after the 9/11 attacks of 2001.

pmorici 5y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police#United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police#United_States

rdtsc 5y ago

Us and those wild Canadians up North too https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Pacific_Police_Service https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Pacific_Police_Serv.... It is crazy here, what can I tell ya ;-)

macinjosh 5y ago

A state run police force I am forced to pay for that has qualified immunity sounds a lot more dystopian to me than a private security firm a company hires to protect its business infrastructure.

LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_Patrol_Special_Police https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_Patrol_Special_P...