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Because then nothing protects members from Russia. If two NATO members go to war, there is no clear side to take. Also, Russia does not want to join. They want

Because then nothing protects members from Russia. If two NATO members go to war, there is no clear side to take. Also, Russia does not want to join. They want the USSR back

remarkEon 5y ago
>They want the USSR back No, they don't, and I don't understand why people (Americans in particular?) seem to think this. Is it just nostalgia for the first Cold War?
- avmich 5y ago
  Yes, there is clear and really big difference between autocratic ideas and the wishes of the population. Unfortunately Russians are weak to keep autocracy off their backs, so they have to suffer from it.
  - nullifidian 5y ago
    >Russians are weak to keep autocracy off their backs And that weakness comes from the complete lack of the political culture needed for a functional democracy. The elite of the Russian empire that had a prototypical form of that culture had been eradicated by the communists, and about 10 years of relative lack of authoritarianism in the 90s and early 2000s wasn't nearly enough to form even a semblance of such culture. An ordinary Russian doesn't know what separation of powers is for, how freedom of speech/expression protects their interests, that it's their taxes that Putin spends, not government's money, the norms of civil debate, the individualist thinking etc etc.
- ed_balls 5y ago
  Putin wants to recreate influence in ex USSR. He stated that in 2002. He tried with soft power, but failed, hence 2008 Georgia 2014 military action in Ukraine. In his recent easy he claimed Ukrainians and Russians are the same nation
lr1970 5y ago
> If two NATO members go to war, there is no clear side to take. In fact there was such a historical precedent. Turkey and Greece, both NATO members, fought a war in Northern Cyprus in 1974 [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_invasion_of_Cyprus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_invasion_of_Cyprus

Because then nothing protects members from Russia. If two NATO members go to war, there is no clear side to take. Also, Russia does not want to join. They want the USSR back

remarkEon 5y ago

>They want the USSR back No, they don't, and I don't understand why people (Americans in particular?) seem to think this. Is it just nostalgia for the first Cold War?

avmich 5y ago
Yes, there is clear and really big difference between autocratic ideas and the wishes of the population. Unfortunately Russians are weak to keep autocracy off their backs, so they have to suffer from it.
- nullifidian 5y ago
  >Russians are weak to keep autocracy off their backs And that weakness comes from the complete lack of the political culture needed for a functional democracy. The elite of the Russian empire that had a prototypical form of that culture had been eradicated by the communists, and about 10 years of relative lack of authoritarianism in the 90s and early 2000s wasn't nearly enough to form even a semblance of such culture. An ordinary Russian doesn't know what separation of powers is for, how freedom of speech/expression protects their interests, that it's their taxes that Putin spends, not government's money, the norms of civil debate, the individualist thinking etc etc.
ed_balls 5y ago
Putin wants to recreate influence in ex USSR. He stated that in 2002. He tried with soft power, but failed, hence 2008 Georgia 2014 military action in Ukraine. In his recent easy he claimed Ukrainians and Russians are the same nation

lr1970 5y ago

> If two NATO members go to war, there is no clear side to take. In fact there was such a historical precedent. Turkey and Greece, both NATO members, fought a war in Northern Cyprus in 1974 [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_invasion_of_Cyprus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_invasion_of_Cyprus