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does everyone really think theyre saving on payroll short- and long- term by not doing COLA? People accept an annual pay cut. They have for decades. Employees

does everyone really think theyre saving on payroll short- and long- term by not doing COLA? People accept an annual pay cut. They have for decades. Employees don't leave, and whether they're happy or not generally doesn't matter so long as the work gets done. Have a look at a graph of the net worth of wealthy people over the past 40 years and then ask yourself if it works long-term because it obviously does.

cableshaft 5y ago
Except this past year it hasn't. Seen any articles about 'The Great Resignation' lately? The pandemic helped change employee attitudes and they're much more willing to quit for a better deal now (and there's plenty of companies desperate enough to give it to them). Companies have always (at least the past few decades) been more willing to pay more for a new hire than to increase compensation to keep an existing employee, so now that everyone is short staffed, people are taking advantage of that reality and quitting their jobs for a new one much more frequently and getting the increases they're being denied from their former "stuck in pre-pandemic mindset" companies.
- onion2k 5y ago
  Seen any articles about 'The Great Resignation' lately? Yep, and very few mention money as the reason why people are leaving their jobs. It's much more often about a re-evaluation of people's priorities. There's no reason to believe people will find new jobs that give cost of living adjustments.
  - cableshaft 5y ago
    Wanting to make more money to keep up or get ahead versus staying put in the same job for years or sometimes decades is a re-evaluation of people's priorities. But it's not the only factor or only priority for a lot of people, sure. There's people in this very thread that say they're planning to interview because they're not getting a COLA adjustment. I already switched jobs and got a significant raise in the process this year, or else I might be joining them if I get a sub-COLA raise (it's sounding like I might based on what I've heard of the process so far). Hell, I still might later this year, I don't know. It wouldn't be the only factor for me, just a factor. Things are mostly good here, but I've stunted my income trajectory quite a bit already by staying way too long at previous jobs, and probably should play a bit more catch-up, and I'm only likely to get that by switching jobs again.
  - pophenat 5y ago
    Well, actually, people quite often mention pay as a reason to quit on forums like reddit. It isn’t the trigger, but low pay and difficulties coping financially, even with multiple jobs, is one of the top reasons that makes people leave their employment.
  - elpescado 5y ago
    > Yep, and very few mention money as the reason why people are leaving their jobs. It's much more often about a re-evaluation of people's priorities. Yet, somehow, the new job is almost always (much) better paid. Strange, isn't it?
- janeroe 5y ago
  > The Great Resignation Any chance it has something to do with mandatory vaccination?
  - antihero 5y ago
    Not really, I think people who are silly enough to quit their jobs over a free vaccine are hopefuly in a small enough (but unfortunately very visible) minority that this isn't a huge factor. I may be wrong, though.
    - janeroe 5y ago
      > over a free vaccine You know what else was free? Bullets in communist Russia and gas in Hitler's Germany. Price is not the only thing that matters.
  - tomrod 5y ago
    Unlikely. JPM and Citi are about to let quite few go, about 3% of workforce, due to Anti-vaccination recalitrance. While 3% feels like a lot, it's less than great resig.
  - cableshaft 5y ago
    Considering the majority of people quitting are in places that have no mandatory vaccinations (service sector in general), it's mostly a negligible factor. In specific industries it might be a somewhat larger factor (health care I do think is more significant, for example). But even in those industries, there's far greater effects leading to people quitting, like quitting to become a traveling nurse and making 3x the pay, or just getting burnt out from the demands of the pandemic. The Great Resignation was already in full force before any vaccine mandates were even in place, also.
  - rootusrootus 5y ago
    For the places that have enforced mandatory vaccination, it seems to end up around ~1% or so of employees that are willing to go that route. And frankly, a substantial number of those are older workers that are probably at retirement age anyway. The "Great Resignation" is much more substantial.
rednerrus 5y ago
Good people don't accept annual pay cuts. That's why companies looking to retain the best talent are doing yearly salary evaluations. Look at what Basecamp and Netflix are doing. Your managers job is to ensure that you're being paid in the top 10% of people in your field in the most expensive COL city in America. That's how you retain the best talent.
- onion2k 5y ago
  Your managers job is to ensure that you're being paid in the top 10% of people in your field in the most expensive COL city in America. That's how you retain the best talent. Everyone's manager should be making sure that everyone is in the top 10% of earners in their field? I'm not very good at math but I'm fairly sure that's impossible.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
anm89 5y ago
Right. When someone with essentially no skin in the game is yelling to the internet about how dumb the people with massive skin in the game who spend all of their time trying to optimize a specific situation, and how they just don't get it, you've got to wonder if it crosses their mind that they are they one with much more limited info who is less likely to "get it". Then again for the most part these people aren't trying to understand what is going on. They just are angry about something and want to yell.

cableshaft 5y ago

Except this past year it hasn't. Seen any articles about 'The Great Resignation' lately? The pandemic helped change employee attitudes and they're much more willing to quit for a better deal now (and there's plenty of companies desperate enough to give it to them). Companies have always (at least the past few decades) been more willing to pay more for a new hire than to increase compensation to keep an existing employee, so now that everyone is short staffed, people are taking advantage of that reality and quitting their jobs for a new one much more frequently and getting the increases they're being denied from their former "stuck in pre-pandemic mindset" companies.

onion2k 5y ago
Seen any articles about 'The Great Resignation' lately? Yep, and very few mention money as the reason why people are leaving their jobs. It's much more often about a re-evaluation of people's priorities. There's no reason to believe people will find new jobs that give cost of living adjustments.
- cableshaft 5y ago
  Wanting to make more money to keep up or get ahead versus staying put in the same job for years or sometimes decades is a re-evaluation of people's priorities. But it's not the only factor or only priority for a lot of people, sure. There's people in this very thread that say they're planning to interview because they're not getting a COLA adjustment. I already switched jobs and got a significant raise in the process this year, or else I might be joining them if I get a sub-COLA raise (it's sounding like I might based on what I've heard of the process so far). Hell, I still might later this year, I don't know. It wouldn't be the only factor for me, just a factor. Things are mostly good here, but I've stunted my income trajectory quite a bit already by staying way too long at previous jobs, and probably should play a bit more catch-up, and I'm only likely to get that by switching jobs again.
- pophenat 5y ago
  Well, actually, people quite often mention pay as a reason to quit on forums like reddit. It isn’t the trigger, but low pay and difficulties coping financially, even with multiple jobs, is one of the top reasons that makes people leave their employment.
- elpescado 5y ago
  > Yep, and very few mention money as the reason why people are leaving their jobs. It's much more often about a re-evaluation of people's priorities. Yet, somehow, the new job is almost always (much) better paid. Strange, isn't it?
janeroe 5y ago
> The Great Resignation Any chance it has something to do with mandatory vaccination?
- antihero 5y ago
  Not really, I think people who are silly enough to quit their jobs over a free vaccine are hopefuly in a small enough (but unfortunately very visible) minority that this isn't a huge factor. I may be wrong, though.
  - janeroe 5y ago
    > over a free vaccine You know what else was free? Bullets in communist Russia and gas in Hitler's Germany. Price is not the only thing that matters.
- tomrod 5y ago
  Unlikely. JPM and Citi are about to let quite few go, about 3% of workforce, due to Anti-vaccination recalitrance. While 3% feels like a lot, it's less than great resig.
- cableshaft 5y ago
  Considering the majority of people quitting are in places that have no mandatory vaccinations (service sector in general), it's mostly a negligible factor. In specific industries it might be a somewhat larger factor (health care I do think is more significant, for example). But even in those industries, there's far greater effects leading to people quitting, like quitting to become a traveling nurse and making 3x the pay, or just getting burnt out from the demands of the pandemic. The Great Resignation was already in full force before any vaccine mandates were even in place, also.
- rootusrootus 5y ago
  For the places that have enforced mandatory vaccination, it seems to end up around ~1% or so of employees that are willing to go that route. And frankly, a substantial number of those are older workers that are probably at retirement age anyway. The "Great Resignation" is much more substantial.

rednerrus 5y ago

Good people don't accept annual pay cuts. That's why companies looking to retain the best talent are doing yearly salary evaluations. Look at what Basecamp and Netflix are doing. Your managers job is to ensure that you're being paid in the top 10% of people in your field in the most expensive COL city in America. That's how you retain the best talent.

onion2k 5y ago
Your managers job is to ensure that you're being paid in the top 10% of people in your field in the most expensive COL city in America. That's how you retain the best talent. Everyone's manager should be making sure that everyone is in the top 10% of earners in their field? I'm not very good at math but I'm fairly sure that's impossible.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

anm89 5y ago

Right. When someone with essentially no skin in the game is yelling to the internet about how dumb the people with massive skin in the game who spend all of their time trying to optimize a specific situation, and how they just don't get it, you've got to wonder if it crosses their mind that they are they one with much more limited info who is less likely to "get it". Then again for the most part these people aren't trying to understand what is going on. They just are angry about something and want to yell.