4 ms·

Framework Laptop provides customization and upgradeability which sounds like what you want. https://frame.work https://frame.work

by rswail 5y ago

vaylian 5y ago
Agreed. I think the disassembly video of the Surface SE is pretty impressive (kudos Microsoft!), but Framework still blows the Surface SE out of the water in terms of internal accessibility and modularity of the laptop: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV2umY3R0vw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV2umY3R0vw
NikolaNovak 5y ago
Framework gets us a long way in the right direction; still lacking things some of us need - admittedly a minority: 1. Standardized keyboard. For some reason modern laptops hate Home/End/PgUp/PgDwn buttons; but I use them literally every minute of my typing. Arrow keys too are tiny, up and down look to be sharing the same key - so basically unusable on regular basis. 2. Trackpoint/Nub/Nipple. If you're trying to make a small laptop, rather than crippling keyboard for the sake of massive giant trackpad, Trackpoint is the way to go. Granted, higher learning curve for many, but very rewarding in the end. Again, understanding we are now talking a niche of a niche - "want standard keyboard and trackpoint" subset of "want practical modular laptop"; but that's why old school Thinkpads are still so prized for some.
- eikenberry 5y ago
  They did give feedback a a while ago that they are looking into the thinkpad style trackpoint/mouse-button interface as a purchasable option in the future.
  - NikolaNovak 5y ago
    Missed that! Awesome sauce, that's incredible to hear :)
- Goronmon 5y ago
  Trackpoint/Nub/Nipple. If you're trying to make a small laptop, rather than crippling keyboard for the sake of massive giant trackpad, Trackpoint is the way to go. Granted, higher learning curve for many, but very rewarding in the end. Yeah, this is the current issue I'm having. I can't bring myself to by a laptop without some form of Trackpoint, which rules out pretty much all but a very small subset.
- sangnoir 5y ago
  > still lacking things some of us need - admittedly a minority: Can't you and a few 100/1000 like-minded people crowdfund a custom Framework keyboard with full-sized arrow keys and and track point? It's designed to have bits of it customized/upgraded (including the keyboard).
  - NikolaNovak 5y ago
    I mean, that's kinda sorta how the Lenovo T25 got to be - a one-of, 5000 copies run of basically T470, but with old-school Thinkpad keyboard. It's what I'm typing on right now (Glee!:) https://www.lenovo.com/gb/en/laptops/thinkpad/thinkpad-25/ThinkPad-25/p/22TP2TTTP25 https://www.lenovo.com/gb/en/laptops/thinkpad/thinkpad-25/Th... Interesting thing to ponder though; I have no idea what manufacturing is like so I assumed that would be much too small of a run to be viable... but I'm completely ignorant.
- adinisom 5y ago
  For (1) you might try ctrl-up/down and in web browsers space and shift-space.
  - NikolaNovak 5y ago
    Thanks, but... 1. Keyboards that have non-standard Home/End/PgUp/PgDwn, also tend to have crippled/unusable up & down arrows. 2. I don't believe that shortcut works in any editor I tend to use; it is when typing text that Home/Ctrl-Home, End/Ctrl-End come in super-handy. (yes, we can now start discussing Vim-style editors etc; but my point is at higher level - we had a standard keyboard layout for literally decades, and now its again a no-man's land of bespoke crippled layouts, presumably in service of thin laptop and vast trackpad)
- justsomehnguy 5y ago
  Ugh, can I ask you to hear my rant? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29807256 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29807256

Framework Laptop provides customization and upgradeability which sounds like what you want. https://frame.work https://frame.work

by rswail 5y ago

Framework Laptop provides customization and upgradeability which sounds like what you want. https://frame.work https://frame.work

vaylian 5y ago

Agreed. I think the disassembly video of the Surface SE is pretty impressive (kudos Microsoft!), but Framework still blows the Surface SE out of the water in terms of internal accessibility and modularity of the laptop: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV2umY3R0vw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV2umY3R0vw

NikolaNovak 5y ago

Framework gets us a long way in the right direction; still lacking things some of us need - admittedly a minority: 1. Standardized keyboard. For some reason modern laptops hate Home/End/PgUp/PgDwn buttons; but I use them literally every minute of my typing. Arrow keys too are tiny, up and down look to be sharing the same key - so basically unusable on regular basis. 2. Trackpoint/Nub/Nipple. If you're trying to make a small laptop, rather than crippling keyboard for the sake of massive giant trackpad, Trackpoint is the way to go. Granted, higher learning curve for many, but very rewarding in the end. Again, understanding we are now talking a niche of a niche - "want standard keyboard and trackpoint" subset of "want practical modular laptop"; but that's why old school Thinkpads are still so prized for some.

eikenberry 5y ago
They did give feedback a a while ago that they are looking into the thinkpad style trackpoint/mouse-button interface as a purchasable option in the future.
- NikolaNovak 5y ago
  Missed that! Awesome sauce, that's incredible to hear :)
Goronmon 5y ago
Trackpoint/Nub/Nipple. If you're trying to make a small laptop, rather than crippling keyboard for the sake of massive giant trackpad, Trackpoint is the way to go. Granted, higher learning curve for many, but very rewarding in the end. Yeah, this is the current issue I'm having. I can't bring myself to by a laptop without some form of Trackpoint, which rules out pretty much all but a very small subset.
sangnoir 5y ago
> still lacking things some of us need - admittedly a minority: Can't you and a few 100/1000 like-minded people crowdfund a custom Framework keyboard with full-sized arrow keys and and track point? It's designed to have bits of it customized/upgraded (including the keyboard).
- NikolaNovak 5y ago
  I mean, that's kinda sorta how the Lenovo T25 got to be - a one-of, 5000 copies run of basically T470, but with old-school Thinkpad keyboard. It's what I'm typing on right now (Glee!:) https://www.lenovo.com/gb/en/laptops/thinkpad/thinkpad-25/ThinkPad-25/p/22TP2TTTP25 https://www.lenovo.com/gb/en/laptops/thinkpad/thinkpad-25/Th... Interesting thing to ponder though; I have no idea what manufacturing is like so I assumed that would be much too small of a run to be viable... but I'm completely ignorant.
adinisom 5y ago
For (1) you might try ctrl-up/down and in web browsers space and shift-space.
- NikolaNovak 5y ago
  Thanks, but... 1. Keyboards that have non-standard Home/End/PgUp/PgDwn, also tend to have crippled/unusable up & down arrows. 2. I don't believe that shortcut works in any editor I tend to use; it is when typing text that Home/Ctrl-Home, End/Ctrl-End come in super-handy. (yes, we can now start discussing Vim-style editors etc; but my point is at higher level - we had a standard keyboard layout for literally decades, and now its again a no-man's land of bespoke crippled layouts, presumably in service of thin laptop and vast trackpad)
justsomehnguy 5y ago
Ugh, can I ask you to hear my rant? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29807256 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29807256