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It’s economic warfare against a destabilized region that only recently quelled constant terrorism. The US casts a blanket assumption that ALL products from the

by jchook 5y ago

It’s economic warfare against a destabilized region that only recently quelled constant terrorism. The US casts a blanket assumption that ALL products from the region are produced by slave labor unless proven otherwise. That’s backwards. And meanwhile US government and corporations have no problem buying products produced by US prison slave labor, or overseas child labor.

ei8htyfi5e 5y ago
It’s absolutely not backwards. When you have a million people in a concentration camp in a given region, and China is known for shipping these slaves around their country to work in factories, to make sanctions and targeted policies more difficult to apply, can you maybe see why a rule of thumb has been created black listing an entire region? This is their choice. Cause. Effect.
- fakeslimshady5 5y ago
- dirtyid 5y ago
  Is that why US also sanctions John Deer from selling tractors to XJ when XJ wanted to automate cotton harvesting because paying "slave" labours high wages was unprofitable. Almost like US wants to XJ to rely on manual labour to perpetuate coerced labour myth. Cause. Effect.
  - ei8htyfi5e 5y ago
    - dirtyid 5y ago
      There's media of Uyghurs working in XJ cotton fields as part of local cotton industry released by PRC media that got repurposed as coerced labour with zero evidence. It's like how videos of XJ transfer workers from their own douyin accounts got repurposed as "leaked" evidence of slave labour. Yes Zenz claims are basically myths, trying to portray extremely well known and studied rural labour transfer programs as coerced labour and connect any piece of mistreatment - of which there inevitably will be for a program this large - to fabricate myth of XJ coerced labour. US sanctioned XPCC in charge of XJ cotton, ergo John Deere can no longer sell advanced cotton picking machinery to XJ cotton industry despite 4000% increase in orders year prior. 70% of XJ cotton was automated already, predominately in North. XPCC wanted to buy harvesters to automate 30% of XJ south cotton that relied more on manual labour until "slave labour" programs paid enough that manual labour no longer profitable. Because slave labour involves compensation so high that importing expensive US machines becomes more economic. So why would US not want John Deere to sell XPCC machines that would eliminate alleged coerced labour... oh wait.
- jchook 5y ago
  “A million people in a concentration camp” says US state agencies who tried to prevent the UN from investigating and Adrian Zenz commissioned by the BBC. Let’s ask the UN what they think about China’s response to terrorism in Xinjiang after investigating. > Faced with the grave challenge of terrorism and extremism, China has undertaken a series of counter-terrorism and deradicalization measures in Xinjiang, including setting up vocational education and training centers. Now safety and security has returned to Xinjiang and the fundamental human rights of people of all ethnic groups there are safeguarded. The past three consecutive years has seen not a single terrorist attack in Xinjiang and people there enjoy a stronger sense of happiness, fulfillment and security. > What they saw and heard in Xinjiang completely contradicted what was reported in the media. We call on relevant countries to refrain from employing unfounded charges against China based on unconfirmed information before they visit Xinjiang. https://undocs.org/pdf?symbol=en/A/HRC/41/G/17 https://undocs.org/pdf?symbol=en/A/HRC/41/G/17
  - ei8htyfi5e 5y ago
    - jchook 5y ago
      Let’s ask the World Bank[1]. > In line with standard practice, immediately after receiving a series of serious allegations in August 2019 in connection with the Xinjiang Technical and Vocational Education and Training Project, the Bank launched a fact-finding review, and World Bank senior managers traveled to Xinjiang to gather information directly. After receiving the allegations, no disbursements were made on the project. > The team conducted a thorough review of project documents, engaged in discussions with project staff, and visited schools directly financed by the project, as well as their partner schools that were the subject of allegations. > The review did not substantiate the allegations. 1. https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world-bank-statement-on-review-of-project-in-xinjiang-china https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world...
      - ei8htyfi5e 5y ago
alkonaut 5y ago
Every country and company on the planet should of course assume the worst - until free and independent media is free to report on it. Are Intel execs given objective reports by independent journalists who are given access to all areas and are free to write an report as they want on it? Until then, Intel execs should assume that any rumor of wrongdoing in the province is true. It's as simple as that. One simply doesn't get the benefit of "no wrongdoing until proven" without a free media.
- jchook 5y ago
  Why doesn’t the US impose sanctions on Saudi Arabia for their genocide of Yemen?
  - network2592 5y ago
  - alkonaut 5y ago
    [flagged]
    - jchook 5y ago
      It's rhetorical -- the US has been ramping up a trade war with China for years now. The US sanctions on Xinjiang damage the region economically and cause more suffering for the people who live there. If the US gov't was truly concerned about human rights abuses, then they would not be so biased against China in particular while turning a blind eye or directly funding other very egregious human rights violations. No the US did not sanction Saudi Arabia for Khashoggi's murder, specifically to avoid damaging their relationship https://sanctionscanner.com/knowledge-base/sanctions-against-saudi-arabia-55l https://sanctionscanner.com/knowledge-base/sanctions-against... > ...the Coalition is conducting an ongoing campaign of genocide by a ‘synchronised attack’ on all aspects of life in Yemen, one that is only possible with the complicity of the United States and United Kingdom. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/01436597.2018.1539910?forwardService=showFullText&tokenAccess=Hm6yabBswxhnzfhR8RSI&tokenDomain=eprints&doi=10.1080%2F01436597.2018.1539910&doi=10.1080%2F01436597.2018.1539910&journalCode=ctwq20 https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/01436597.2018.15...
vorpalhex 5y ago
We are cracking down on slave labor supply chains. We are merely starting with the worst offender: China.
- jchook 5y ago
  The US imprisons 5x as many people per capita as China and buys billions of dollars of products made by US prison slave labor. They could start there.
  - vorpalhex 5y ago
    You can't know that because China doesn't publish stats for it's secret ethnic genocide program. If you want to petition for better prisons, please do so. Please do not detract from the campaign of ethnic cleaning the rest of us are talking about.
trasz 5y ago
Look at this from a larger perspective. US killed a million random civilians in an attempt to to squash terrorism - and largely failed. China appears to have achieved this in an incomparably more humanitarian way. If this works out, this means: 1. USA failed (again) 2. They committed world's largest genocide since WW2 3. For no good reason This is an absolutely terrible outcome from PR point of view, so it's natural for US to try to prevent China from being successful in doing that. And pretending that temporarily imprisoning people is somehow more evil than killing them seems to be working, even here on HN.
- yakz 5y ago
  This has absolutely nothing to do with Intel or Xinjiang.
  - network2592 5y ago
    It is just a common whataboutism technique used by Wu Mao [0]. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29893724 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29893724

by jchook 5y ago

ei8htyfi5e 5y ago

It’s absolutely not backwards. When you have a million people in a concentration camp in a given region, and China is known for shipping these slaves around their country to work in factories, to make sanctions and targeted policies more difficult to apply, can you maybe see why a rule of thumb has been created black listing an entire region? This is their choice. Cause. Effect.

fakeslimshady5 5y ago
dirtyid 5y ago
Is that why US also sanctions John Deer from selling tractors to XJ when XJ wanted to automate cotton harvesting because paying "slave" labours high wages was unprofitable. Almost like US wants to XJ to rely on manual labour to perpetuate coerced labour myth. Cause. Effect.
- ei8htyfi5e 5y ago
  - dirtyid 5y ago
    There's media of Uyghurs working in XJ cotton fields as part of local cotton industry released by PRC media that got repurposed as coerced labour with zero evidence. It's like how videos of XJ transfer workers from their own douyin accounts got repurposed as "leaked" evidence of slave labour. Yes Zenz claims are basically myths, trying to portray extremely well known and studied rural labour transfer programs as coerced labour and connect any piece of mistreatment - of which there inevitably will be for a program this large - to fabricate myth of XJ coerced labour. US sanctioned XPCC in charge of XJ cotton, ergo John Deere can no longer sell advanced cotton picking machinery to XJ cotton industry despite 4000% increase in orders year prior. 70% of XJ cotton was automated already, predominately in North. XPCC wanted to buy harvesters to automate 30% of XJ south cotton that relied more on manual labour until "slave labour" programs paid enough that manual labour no longer profitable. Because slave labour involves compensation so high that importing expensive US machines becomes more economic. So why would US not want John Deere to sell XPCC machines that would eliminate alleged coerced labour... oh wait.
jchook 5y ago
“A million people in a concentration camp” says US state agencies who tried to prevent the UN from investigating and Adrian Zenz commissioned by the BBC. Let’s ask the UN what they think about China’s response to terrorism in Xinjiang after investigating. > Faced with the grave challenge of terrorism and extremism, China has undertaken a series of counter-terrorism and deradicalization measures in Xinjiang, including setting up vocational education and training centers. Now safety and security has returned to Xinjiang and the fundamental human rights of people of all ethnic groups there are safeguarded. The past three consecutive years has seen not a single terrorist attack in Xinjiang and people there enjoy a stronger sense of happiness, fulfillment and security. > What they saw and heard in Xinjiang completely contradicted what was reported in the media. We call on relevant countries to refrain from employing unfounded charges against China based on unconfirmed information before they visit Xinjiang. https://undocs.org/pdf?symbol=en/A/HRC/41/G/17 https://undocs.org/pdf?symbol=en/A/HRC/41/G/17
- ei8htyfi5e 5y ago
  - jchook 5y ago
    Let’s ask the World Bank[1]. > In line with standard practice, immediately after receiving a series of serious allegations in August 2019 in connection with the Xinjiang Technical and Vocational Education and Training Project, the Bank launched a fact-finding review, and World Bank senior managers traveled to Xinjiang to gather information directly. After receiving the allegations, no disbursements were made on the project. > The team conducted a thorough review of project documents, engaged in discussions with project staff, and visited schools directly financed by the project, as well as their partner schools that were the subject of allegations. > The review did not substantiate the allegations. 1. https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world-bank-statement-on-review-of-project-in-xinjiang-china https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world...
    - ei8htyfi5e 5y ago

alkonaut 5y ago

Every country and company on the planet should of course assume the worst - until free and independent media is free to report on it. Are Intel execs given objective reports by independent journalists who are given access to all areas and are free to write an report as they want on it? Until then, Intel execs should assume that any rumor of wrongdoing in the province is true. It's as simple as that. One simply doesn't get the benefit of "no wrongdoing until proven" without a free media.

jchook 5y ago
Why doesn’t the US impose sanctions on Saudi Arabia for their genocide of Yemen?
- network2592 5y ago
- alkonaut 5y ago
  [flagged]
  - jchook 5y ago
    It's rhetorical -- the US has been ramping up a trade war with China for years now. The US sanctions on Xinjiang damage the region economically and cause more suffering for the people who live there. If the US gov't was truly concerned about human rights abuses, then they would not be so biased against China in particular while turning a blind eye or directly funding other very egregious human rights violations. No the US did not sanction Saudi Arabia for Khashoggi's murder, specifically to avoid damaging their relationship https://sanctionscanner.com/knowledge-base/sanctions-against-saudi-arabia-55l https://sanctionscanner.com/knowledge-base/sanctions-against... > ...the Coalition is conducting an ongoing campaign of genocide by a ‘synchronised attack’ on all aspects of life in Yemen, one that is only possible with the complicity of the United States and United Kingdom. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/01436597.2018.1539910?forwardService=showFullText&tokenAccess=Hm6yabBswxhnzfhR8RSI&tokenDomain=eprints&doi=10.1080%2F01436597.2018.1539910&doi=10.1080%2F01436597.2018.1539910&journalCode=ctwq20 https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/01436597.2018.15...

vorpalhex 5y ago

We are cracking down on slave labor supply chains. We are merely starting with the worst offender: China.

jchook 5y ago
The US imprisons 5x as many people per capita as China and buys billions of dollars of products made by US prison slave labor. They could start there.
- vorpalhex 5y ago
  You can't know that because China doesn't publish stats for it's secret ethnic genocide program. If you want to petition for better prisons, please do so. Please do not detract from the campaign of ethnic cleaning the rest of us are talking about.

trasz 5y ago

Look at this from a larger perspective. US killed a million random civilians in an attempt to to squash terrorism - and largely failed. China appears to have achieved this in an incomparably more humanitarian way. If this works out, this means: 1. USA failed (again) 2. They committed world's largest genocide since WW2 3. For no good reason This is an absolutely terrible outcome from PR point of view, so it's natural for US to try to prevent China from being successful in doing that. And pretending that temporarily imprisoning people is somehow more evil than killing them seems to be working, even here on HN.

yakz 5y ago
This has absolutely nothing to do with Intel or Xinjiang.
- network2592 5y ago
  It is just a common whataboutism technique used by Wu Mao [0]. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29893724 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29893724