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What are the long term effects of multiple rounds of boosters? You have no idea. The mechanism by which mRNA vaccines work is different than standard vaccines.

by PKop 5y ago

What are the long term effects of multiple rounds of boosters? You have no idea. The mechanism by which mRNA vaccines work is different than standard vaccines. What are the unintended consequences? You have no idea. What is the risk if of COVID, especially the weakened Omicron strain? The CDC Director states that 75% of COVID deaths occurred in people with 4 comorbidities [0]. For someone under 50 that is fit and isn't overweight, COVID is statistically nothing to worry about. And this person already got sick so has natural immunity. What is the sense in assuming the prudent course of action is injecting a new pharmacological substance in your body instead of just allowing your own immune system to protect you naturally? Most drugs go through multiple rounds, over many years, of FDA testing and often side effects are discovered. What is gained by taking it? Almost nothing. What is risked? You don't know. I think the smart money will be on the side of the cohort that avoided this mind-virus of being gaslit into taking some pharma drug instead of just facing the minimal threat head on. [0] https://twitter.com/Lukewearechange/status/1480595156483072001 https://twitter.com/Lukewearechange/status/14805951564830720...

hhmc 5y ago
It's interesting that you're concerned about the long term _effects_ of boosters, but COVID is nothing to worry about since you're only concerned with _deaths_. Seems disengenous.
- PKop 5y ago
  The vaccines don't prevent people from getting covid, so why accumulate risks? In any case, common sense says the natural coronavirus would be handled by your body in predictable ways versus the new mRNA engineered substance. Are you telling me since you got the vaccines, you actually think you're going to avoid getting COVID? If this is not what you think, then what the hell are you talking about?
  - snowwrestler 5y ago
    The body handles the mRNA vaccine more predictably than the naturally occurring viable coronavirus. This is not a matter of common sense; it’s possible to test in vitro and in field trials (and there have been a lot of both). The reason is in part because there is less variability from dose to dose of an mRNA vaccine than there is among extant variants of viable SARS-COV-2 coronavirus. That makes it easier to predict what will happen. And it is in part because mRNA vaccines are built up from the existing biochemistry of the body. That is, mRNA vaccines are not a new thing we created, they are a distillation of a natural system that we discovered and studied.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
gilbetron 5y ago
So you are choosing between two things A) Hasn't been around long, we know it can have some horrible long-term effects. B) Hasn't been around long, have found almost zero long-term effects, yet. A has at least 100x chance of dying than B, and at least 1000x chance of hospitalization. And you think it is sensical to choose A? I don't get it.
- PKop 5y ago
  I'm not obese, I lift weights, I'm under 50 and I get lots of vitamin D? You know, common sense and that which correlates with the data of covid risk. If you are unhealthy or fat I can see hoping the vaccine will save you from your lifestyle choices. If not, then what are you afraid of? The vaccines will not prevent you from getting covid. So what's with all the convoluted thinking where you pretend you won't get it? The risks of death from covid are a rounding error if you're young and healthy. People mistakenly act as if this disease is affecting everyone in severe ways equally. It is drastically skewed to older and unhealthy. You have no idea what the long term effects of the vaccine are stop pretending like you do, it's ridiculous.
  - zuminator 5y ago
    This is not our first rodeo with vaccines. So we do in fact have excellent reasons to believe they don't cause delayed long term effects. That is, if there were long term effects, they would manifest themselves in short order. There's no biological mechanism for a vaccine to lurk in hiding for years and then suddenly cause a brain tumor or chronic inflammation or what have you. "When new vaccines are released, the unknown side effects, if any, show up within two months of vaccination. This history goes back to at least the 1960s with the oral polio vaccine and examples continue through today." [0] "First, when these [delayed side effect] events occurred, the onset was within eight weeks of receipt of the vaccine. Second, in all of these cases, except narcolepsy following H1N1 vaccine, the side effect of the vaccine was something that could be caused by the infection, meaning that getting infected with the virus also carried a risk of experiencing these outcomes. " [1] "Forget adverse effects over five or ten years: the way your immune system works does not allow for such long-term safety concerns." [2] [0] https://www.muhealth.org/our-stories/how-do-we-know-covid-19-vaccine-wont-have-long-term-side-effects https://www.muhealth.org/our-stories/how-do-we-know-covid-19... [1] https://www.chop.edu/news/long-term-side-effects-covid-19-vaccine https://www.chop.edu/news/long-term-side-effects-covid-19-va... [2] https://bostonreview.net/articles/the-long-term-safety-argument-over-covid-19-vaccines/ https://bostonreview.net/articles/the-long-term-safety-argum...
tzs 5y ago
> What is the sense in assuming the prudent course of action is injecting a new pharmacological substance in your body instead of just allowing your own immune system to protect you naturally? Your immune system provides very little natural protection until after you have been infected at least once, which subjects you to all the risks of actually having COVID. The point of vaccination is to get your immune system to that point without having to go through actually having COVID first. > Most drugs go through multiple rounds, over many years, of FDA testing and often side effects are discovered. Vaccines aren't most drugs. For the mRNA vaccines all ingredients are known to be long term safe except the actual mRNA itself, but the mRNA makes no permanent change nor does it last very long, so any bad effects from the mRNA itself must show up short term. (This has also been the case for all previous vaccines--if something bad was going to happen it didn't take long to show up). The spike protein that the mRNA instructs some of your cells to make also does not persist. Your immune system does react to it which will cause long term changes--but those changes are the whole point of vaccination, and they are the same changes that would be made if you were not vaccinated and caught COVID. In an alternate reality where SARS-CoV-2 was not going to become endemic and it might be possible to purposefully avoid getting COVID long enough for us to eliminate the virus you could maybe make a case for that instead of getting vaccinated. We are not in that branch of reality. Unless you happen to have a short remaining lifespan, you will get COVID at some point. The health downsides of doing so unvaccinated are now a superset of the health downsides of getting vaccinated first. > What is gained by taking it? Almost nothing. An order of magnitude reduction in the risk of hospitalization, and an even larger reduction in the risk of death, from COVID.

by PKop 5y ago

hhmc 5y ago

It's interesting that you're concerned about the long term _effects_ of boosters, but COVID is nothing to worry about since you're only concerned with _deaths_. Seems disengenous.

PKop 5y ago
The vaccines don't prevent people from getting covid, so why accumulate risks? In any case, common sense says the natural coronavirus would be handled by your body in predictable ways versus the new mRNA engineered substance. Are you telling me since you got the vaccines, you actually think you're going to avoid getting COVID? If this is not what you think, then what the hell are you talking about?
- snowwrestler 5y ago
  The body handles the mRNA vaccine more predictably than the naturally occurring viable coronavirus. This is not a matter of common sense; it’s possible to test in vitro and in field trials (and there have been a lot of both). The reason is in part because there is less variability from dose to dose of an mRNA vaccine than there is among extant variants of viable SARS-COV-2 coronavirus. That makes it easier to predict what will happen. And it is in part because mRNA vaccines are built up from the existing biochemistry of the body. That is, mRNA vaccines are not a new thing we created, they are a distillation of a natural system that we discovered and studied.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

gilbetron 5y ago

So you are choosing between two things A) Hasn't been around long, we know it can have some horrible long-term effects. B) Hasn't been around long, have found almost zero long-term effects, yet. A has at least 100x chance of dying than B, and at least 1000x chance of hospitalization. And you think it is sensical to choose A? I don't get it.

PKop 5y ago
I'm not obese, I lift weights, I'm under 50 and I get lots of vitamin D? You know, common sense and that which correlates with the data of covid risk. If you are unhealthy or fat I can see hoping the vaccine will save you from your lifestyle choices. If not, then what are you afraid of? The vaccines will not prevent you from getting covid. So what's with all the convoluted thinking where you pretend you won't get it? The risks of death from covid are a rounding error if you're young and healthy. People mistakenly act as if this disease is affecting everyone in severe ways equally. It is drastically skewed to older and unhealthy. You have no idea what the long term effects of the vaccine are stop pretending like you do, it's ridiculous.
- zuminator 5y ago
  This is not our first rodeo with vaccines. So we do in fact have excellent reasons to believe they don't cause delayed long term effects. That is, if there were long term effects, they would manifest themselves in short order. There's no biological mechanism for a vaccine to lurk in hiding for years and then suddenly cause a brain tumor or chronic inflammation or what have you. "When new vaccines are released, the unknown side effects, if any, show up within two months of vaccination. This history goes back to at least the 1960s with the oral polio vaccine and examples continue through today." [0] "First, when these [delayed side effect] events occurred, the onset was within eight weeks of receipt of the vaccine. Second, in all of these cases, except narcolepsy following H1N1 vaccine, the side effect of the vaccine was something that could be caused by the infection, meaning that getting infected with the virus also carried a risk of experiencing these outcomes. " [1] "Forget adverse effects over five or ten years: the way your immune system works does not allow for such long-term safety concerns." [2] [0] https://www.muhealth.org/our-stories/how-do-we-know-covid-19-vaccine-wont-have-long-term-side-effects https://www.muhealth.org/our-stories/how-do-we-know-covid-19... [1] https://www.chop.edu/news/long-term-side-effects-covid-19-vaccine https://www.chop.edu/news/long-term-side-effects-covid-19-va... [2] https://bostonreview.net/articles/the-long-term-safety-argument-over-covid-19-vaccines/ https://bostonreview.net/articles/the-long-term-safety-argum...

tzs 5y ago

> What is the sense in assuming the prudent course of action is injecting a new pharmacological substance in your body instead of just allowing your own immune system to protect you naturally? Your immune system provides very little natural protection until after you have been infected at least once, which subjects you to all the risks of actually having COVID. The point of vaccination is to get your immune system to that point without having to go through actually having COVID first. > Most drugs go through multiple rounds, over many years, of FDA testing and often side effects are discovered. Vaccines aren't most drugs. For the mRNA vaccines all ingredients are known to be long term safe except the actual mRNA itself, but the mRNA makes no permanent change nor does it last very long, so any bad effects from the mRNA itself must show up short term. (This has also been the case for all previous vaccines--if something bad was going to happen it didn't take long to show up). The spike protein that the mRNA instructs some of your cells to make also does not persist. Your immune system does react to it which will cause long term changes--but those changes are the whole point of vaccination, and they are the same changes that would be made if you were not vaccinated and caught COVID. In an alternate reality where SARS-CoV-2 was not going to become endemic and it might be possible to purposefully avoid getting COVID long enough for us to eliminate the virus you could maybe make a case for that instead of getting vaccinated. We are not in that branch of reality. Unless you happen to have a short remaining lifespan, you will get COVID at some point. The health downsides of doing so unvaccinated are now a superset of the health downsides of getting vaccinated first. > What is gained by taking it? Almost nothing. An order of magnitude reduction in the risk of hospitalization, and an even larger reduction in the risk of death, from COVID.