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by nkurz 5y ago

everybodyknows 5y ago
> In the year before the attempted revolution, the U.S. National Endowment for democracy spent more than $1M in the country. > The money went to PR campaigns against the government and training anti-government protesters. An extraordinary claim -- but no supporting evidence offered.
- erentz 5y ago
  Russia seems to point at things like this to create a silly narrative that their actions are actually America’s fault. Lots of people lap that kind of thing up in the west then excuse Russia for their crap. It’s amazingly effective.
  - koheripbal 5y ago
    No. That funding is right on the NED website.
    - erentz 5y ago
      No. A measly $1 million of funding from an American NGO to prodemocracy initiatives in an authoritarian country racked by inflation and other longer running issues is NOT to blame for Putin deciding to invade. Putin makes his own decisions and the people of Kazakhstan have their own agency, they are not stupid puppets of America.
      - sudosysgen 5y ago
        You can argue it's not the proximal cause (which would imply arguing that the only thing the US did was spend a million dollars), but you can't argue that the US was promoting revolution. The citizens of Kazakhstan, just like the citzens of Syria have their own agency. That doesn't mean you can't get played. Unless you mean that Kazaks have agency but the Syrians and Libyans didn't? The best we can conclude here is that we don't know if this is or isn't in some way influenced by the US and some other foreign groups inherently. You can't say that the US definitely isn't angling for something here. That's the issue with meddling in other countries politics, people can reasonably suspect you're at fault when things happen.
      - unmole 5y ago
        But a troll farm operation counts as electoral interference?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- null4bl3 5y ago
  It's on NED'S own site what they have been doing : https://www.ned.org/region/eurasia/kazakhstan-2020/ https://www.ned.org/region/eurasia/kazakhstan-2020/
- sudosysgen 5y ago
  How is this an extraordinary claim? Are we just acting as if US financing of revolutions is extraordinary? Of course there should be evidence (which is readily available), but this is so far from extraordinary it's not even funny.

Thread readable version: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1479517789450911747.html https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1479517789450911747.html

by nkurz 5y ago

Thread readable version: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1479517789450911747.html https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1479517789450911747.html

everybodyknows 5y ago

> In the year before the attempted revolution, the U.S. National Endowment for democracy spent more than $1M in the country. > The money went to PR campaigns against the government and training anti-government protesters. An extraordinary claim -- but no supporting evidence offered.

erentz 5y ago
Russia seems to point at things like this to create a silly narrative that their actions are actually America’s fault. Lots of people lap that kind of thing up in the west then excuse Russia for their crap. It’s amazingly effective.
- koheripbal 5y ago
  No. That funding is right on the NED website.
  - erentz 5y ago
    No. A measly $1 million of funding from an American NGO to prodemocracy initiatives in an authoritarian country racked by inflation and other longer running issues is NOT to blame for Putin deciding to invade. Putin makes his own decisions and the people of Kazakhstan have their own agency, they are not stupid puppets of America.
    - sudosysgen 5y ago
      You can argue it's not the proximal cause (which would imply arguing that the only thing the US did was spend a million dollars), but you can't argue that the US was promoting revolution. The citizens of Kazakhstan, just like the citzens of Syria have their own agency. That doesn't mean you can't get played. Unless you mean that Kazaks have agency but the Syrians and Libyans didn't? The best we can conclude here is that we don't know if this is or isn't in some way influenced by the US and some other foreign groups inherently. You can't say that the US definitely isn't angling for something here. That's the issue with meddling in other countries politics, people can reasonably suspect you're at fault when things happen.
    - unmole 5y ago
      But a troll farm operation counts as electoral interference?
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
null4bl3 5y ago
It's on NED'S own site what they have been doing : https://www.ned.org/region/eurasia/kazakhstan-2020/ https://www.ned.org/region/eurasia/kazakhstan-2020/
sudosysgen 5y ago
How is this an extraordinary claim? Are we just acting as if US financing of revolutions is extraordinary? Of course there should be evidence (which is readily available), but this is so far from extraordinary it's not even funny.