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Outwardly, Europeans are very tolerant. However, their society is pretty homogeneous, especially outside of large metropolitan areas. In my opinion, a lot of th

Outwardly, Europeans are very tolerant. However, their society is pretty homogeneous, especially outside of large metropolitan areas. In my opinion, a lot of their tolerance is lip service because its not really a problem they need to confront on a daily basis. This is just an anecdote, but I was walking with a friend in Berlin and we went to get on the subway. A group of guys came up to us, pushed us out of the car and said "No Asians allowed." No one else on the car really cared.

pyuser583 5y ago
The most racially diverse international organization in Europe is NATO.
R0b0t1 5y ago
But does it really need to be anything more than lip service? Who wants to give away their own stuff or sacrifice their own children's chance at life so that some random person can live? Is it fair to expect everyone to be the Biblical Jesus? It may not immediately look like those things are happening in your life or the lives of people you know, but when you look at e.g. the US, you see people advocating for programs that given housing, education, and other financial aid ti immigrants but do nothing for the poor we already have here. It is difficult to accept, but it's likely best we leave those people to starve out of sight somewhere our conscience can bear it. There's lots of places in the world that begin starving at the slightest economic downturn -- this is probably an indication that that land can't support the number of people on it.
- random314 5y ago
  > Who wants to give away their own stuff or sacrifice their own children's chance at life so that some random person can live? This is a standard, right wing, racist trope that has no connection with reality - hinging on zero sum subterfuge. Adding working age immigrants to an economy increases the size of the pie for everyone. If anyone is negatively affecting the economy it is the retired person who is drawing on health services. It is doubly absurd to make such a statement in the midst of a Brexit driven down spiral of the British economy. Btw, significant percentage of health care workers in western countries are immigrants, as the previous generation has suppressed their own fertility creating an unstable economic situation that can only be solved through immigration. It's the same generation that keeps whinging about immigrants on whom they are totally dependent upon for health care. The reality is in fact the opposite. The parents want to sacrifice their own children's chance at life so that they can block a random person's immigration to feed their own tribal instincts. > e.g. the US, you see people advocating for programs that given housing, education, and other financial aid ti immigrants but do nothing for the poor we already have here. Sure buddy.
  - blub 5y ago
    Not sure what highly qualified immigrants the US or your country are getting, but in Western/Northern Europe there's a significant influx of uneducated and poorly qualified immigrants which cost national governments tens of billions of EUR to house, feed and take care of and have almost zero hope of producing anything for the local economy during their lifetime, because they will be either stuck in dead-end jobs or live on government support. And all these countries already have ghettos from the previous generations of immigrants which were not integrated in the host society. Few would complain if doctors, engineers and software developers would be coming in droves, begging to learn the local language and contribute to the economy.
    - random314 5y ago
      Is this is a cleaned up version of "They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people." UK happily got rid of its uneducated, unwanted east European deplorable immigrants. Funny how that is going. https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/rzoidg/farmers_to_have_18_billion_prebrexit_cash_removed/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/rzoidg/f... Immigrants primarily show up looking for work. It helps the economy of the host country, whether they are blue collar or white collar. If there is no employment to be found, they won't come. > Few would complain if doctors, engineers and software developers would be coming in droves, begging to learn the local language and contribute to the economy. They would complain about it too. However, you let your racism mask slip when you use phrases like " begging to learn the local language". You want immigrants to be groveling and begging to seek your approval for being allowed in to a place. You should realize that you don't actually have any power to grant or revoke approvals. You can build fantasy worlds in your head, but don't confuse it with reality. And I don't have to argue with your fact free and citation free statement that immigrants in "dead end" jobs don't contribute to the economy, because there seems to be a lack of basic understanding of what an economy is and how it works.
jmopp 5y ago
I've been thinking a lot about this. It seems to me that because many people in Europe have grown up in such homogeneous societies, there is a tendency to have blind spots when it comes to race. A recent example I can think of is how the Dutch justice minister said that if the Netherlands were a narco-state, then there would be someone with an exotic background in his place. I don't think he intended to be racist, I just think he didn't realise what he was saying had racist undertones.

pyuser583 5y ago

The most racially diverse international organization in Europe is NATO.

R0b0t1 5y ago

But does it really need to be anything more than lip service? Who wants to give away their own stuff or sacrifice their own children's chance at life so that some random person can live? Is it fair to expect everyone to be the Biblical Jesus? It may not immediately look like those things are happening in your life or the lives of people you know, but when you look at e.g. the US, you see people advocating for programs that given housing, education, and other financial aid ti immigrants but do nothing for the poor we already have here. It is difficult to accept, but it's likely best we leave those people to starve out of sight somewhere our conscience can bear it. There's lots of places in the world that begin starving at the slightest economic downturn -- this is probably an indication that that land can't support the number of people on it.

random314 5y ago
> Who wants to give away their own stuff or sacrifice their own children's chance at life so that some random person can live? This is a standard, right wing, racist trope that has no connection with reality - hinging on zero sum subterfuge. Adding working age immigrants to an economy increases the size of the pie for everyone. If anyone is negatively affecting the economy it is the retired person who is drawing on health services. It is doubly absurd to make such a statement in the midst of a Brexit driven down spiral of the British economy. Btw, significant percentage of health care workers in western countries are immigrants, as the previous generation has suppressed their own fertility creating an unstable economic situation that can only be solved through immigration. It's the same generation that keeps whinging about immigrants on whom they are totally dependent upon for health care. The reality is in fact the opposite. The parents want to sacrifice their own children's chance at life so that they can block a random person's immigration to feed their own tribal instincts. > e.g. the US, you see people advocating for programs that given housing, education, and other financial aid ti immigrants but do nothing for the poor we already have here. Sure buddy.
- blub 5y ago
  Not sure what highly qualified immigrants the US or your country are getting, but in Western/Northern Europe there's a significant influx of uneducated and poorly qualified immigrants which cost national governments tens of billions of EUR to house, feed and take care of and have almost zero hope of producing anything for the local economy during their lifetime, because they will be either stuck in dead-end jobs or live on government support. And all these countries already have ghettos from the previous generations of immigrants which were not integrated in the host society. Few would complain if doctors, engineers and software developers would be coming in droves, begging to learn the local language and contribute to the economy.
  - random314 5y ago
    Is this is a cleaned up version of "They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people." UK happily got rid of its uneducated, unwanted east European deplorable immigrants. Funny how that is going. https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/rzoidg/farmers_to_have_18_billion_prebrexit_cash_removed/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/rzoidg/f... Immigrants primarily show up looking for work. It helps the economy of the host country, whether they are blue collar or white collar. If there is no employment to be found, they won't come. > Few would complain if doctors, engineers and software developers would be coming in droves, begging to learn the local language and contribute to the economy. They would complain about it too. However, you let your racism mask slip when you use phrases like " begging to learn the local language". You want immigrants to be groveling and begging to seek your approval for being allowed in to a place. You should realize that you don't actually have any power to grant or revoke approvals. You can build fantasy worlds in your head, but don't confuse it with reality. And I don't have to argue with your fact free and citation free statement that immigrants in "dead end" jobs don't contribute to the economy, because there seems to be a lack of basic understanding of what an economy is and how it works.

jmopp 5y ago

I've been thinking a lot about this. It seems to me that because many people in Europe have grown up in such homogeneous societies, there is a tendency to have blind spots when it comes to race. A recent example I can think of is how the Dutch justice minister said that if the Netherlands were a narco-state, then there would be someone with an exotic background in his place. I don't think he intended to be racist, I just think he didn't realise what he was saying had racist undertones.