5 ms·

The healthcare system in the United States is debatably one of the worst in the world. Cheers to California for trying to find a way to guarantee that all Calif

by jppope 5y ago

The healthcare system in the United States is debatably one of the worst in the world. Cheers to California for trying to find a way to guarantee that all Californian's have access to the worlds worst healthcare system.

likeabbas 5y ago
The US health care treatments are the best in the world, just the costs are higher than the rest of the world.
- baq 5y ago
  the system is one of the worst in aggregate even if top percentiles are the best. it's extremely unbalanced.
- _moof 5y ago
  Please elaborate on what you mean when you say that US health care treatments are the best in the world.
  - likeabbas 5y ago
    When you have a good insurance provider, the health care is top notch. You're able to choose your doctors, hospitals and that can make a big difference in your health care coverage. You're also able to get coverage for things that most single-payer systems won't cover. Last year I was able to choose my surgeon who operated on my knee last year and my total out of pocket expenses were less than $500 for a $20k surgery. In most single-payer health care systems I wouldn't have been able to get the surgery because it was elective and only a partial tear of my patellar tendon.
- ARandumGuy 5y ago
  While the US does contain some stellar hospitals and surgeons, by broader metrics the US performs poorly. From 2010 to 2015 (before COVID messed with the data), the US ranked 43rd [1] in overall life expectancy. This is behind countries like Cuba and Slovenia, and well behind other rich countries like Japan, Canada, or the UK. Healthcare costs and outcomes can't be separated from each other. The more expensive it is to receive treatment, the fewer people will get the treatment they need. Having good service isn't sufficient if that service isn't available to everyone. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_past_life_expectancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_past_life...
  - likeabbas 5y ago
    Right but if you only consider those that are covered by health insurance then overall health quality is top notch. In the US system you have the luxury of choosing your providers and having your insurance cover things (like elective surgeries) that wouldn't be covered by single payer systems. For example, I had a knee surgery for a partial patellar tendon tear last year that cost me <$500 out of pocket (insurance was billed $20k) and this surgery wouldn't have been covered by any single payer health care system.
    - ARandumGuy 5y ago
      And I'm sure Kim Jong-un gets fantastic healthcare, but that doesn't change the fact that North Korea is ranked #124 in life expectancy. I'm happy the American healthcare system worked well for you. And I'm sure there's plenty of people in Canada who've had terrible experiences with their healthcare system. But that doesn't change the fact that the average Canadian has better health outcomes then the average American. The American healthcare system fails to support many people most needing help. The fact that the richest country on the planet doesn't provide adequate healthcare to everyone is an embarrassment. Something needs to change, and I refuse to believe that we can't (or shouldn't) provide world class healthcare to every American.
    - jjav 5y ago
      > Right but if you only consider those that are covered by health insurance then overall health quality is top notch. That is debatable. I have the top-tier plan my employes makes available (blue shield platinum). It's $2500/month. That still doesn't guarantee anything, if the insurance company doesn't feel like paying it because it cuts into their profit margin too much. Right now I've been prescribed some medicine I need to heal some damage and I can't get it because insurance company says "too expensive, we don't feel like paying for it, sucks to be you". (Wrapped in many pages of legalese, not those exact words.) > In the US system you have the luxury of choosing your providers and having your insurance cover things Well no, not really. If you mean chose between gold and platinum levels offered by employer, ok, but that's the extent of the choice. I'd like to choose an insurance company that gives me the medicines my doctor prescribes me. But no, I have no such choice available.
PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
so many metrics for "good healthcare" and "bad healthcare", so a little expansion might be wise. * availability of a wide set of health procedures * median time to delivery of a given health procedure * outcomes from specific medical conditions * expected longevity, measured at various points at or after birth * cost of a given health procedure * median proximity to health care facilities * percentage of population without access to a given level of care * ... The USA does well on some metrics and badly on others. The one metric which is totally unambigous is the absurd cost we pay both in aggregate and for specific medical procedures, along with the lack of access to healthcare among the population.

by jppope 5y ago

likeabbas 5y ago

The US health care treatments are the best in the world, just the costs are higher than the rest of the world.

baq 5y ago
the system is one of the worst in aggregate even if top percentiles are the best. it's extremely unbalanced.
_moof 5y ago
Please elaborate on what you mean when you say that US health care treatments are the best in the world.
- likeabbas 5y ago
  When you have a good insurance provider, the health care is top notch. You're able to choose your doctors, hospitals and that can make a big difference in your health care coverage. You're also able to get coverage for things that most single-payer systems won't cover. Last year I was able to choose my surgeon who operated on my knee last year and my total out of pocket expenses were less than $500 for a $20k surgery. In most single-payer health care systems I wouldn't have been able to get the surgery because it was elective and only a partial tear of my patellar tendon.
ARandumGuy 5y ago
While the US does contain some stellar hospitals and surgeons, by broader metrics the US performs poorly. From 2010 to 2015 (before COVID messed with the data), the US ranked 43rd [1] in overall life expectancy. This is behind countries like Cuba and Slovenia, and well behind other rich countries like Japan, Canada, or the UK. Healthcare costs and outcomes can't be separated from each other. The more expensive it is to receive treatment, the fewer people will get the treatment they need. Having good service isn't sufficient if that service isn't available to everyone. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_past_life_expectancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_past_life...
- likeabbas 5y ago
  Right but if you only consider those that are covered by health insurance then overall health quality is top notch. In the US system you have the luxury of choosing your providers and having your insurance cover things (like elective surgeries) that wouldn't be covered by single payer systems. For example, I had a knee surgery for a partial patellar tendon tear last year that cost me <$500 out of pocket (insurance was billed $20k) and this surgery wouldn't have been covered by any single payer health care system.
  - ARandumGuy 5y ago
    And I'm sure Kim Jong-un gets fantastic healthcare, but that doesn't change the fact that North Korea is ranked #124 in life expectancy. I'm happy the American healthcare system worked well for you. And I'm sure there's plenty of people in Canada who've had terrible experiences with their healthcare system. But that doesn't change the fact that the average Canadian has better health outcomes then the average American. The American healthcare system fails to support many people most needing help. The fact that the richest country on the planet doesn't provide adequate healthcare to everyone is an embarrassment. Something needs to change, and I refuse to believe that we can't (or shouldn't) provide world class healthcare to every American.
  - jjav 5y ago
    > Right but if you only consider those that are covered by health insurance then overall health quality is top notch. That is debatable. I have the top-tier plan my employes makes available (blue shield platinum). It's $2500/month. That still doesn't guarantee anything, if the insurance company doesn't feel like paying it because it cuts into their profit margin too much. Right now I've been prescribed some medicine I need to heal some damage and I can't get it because insurance company says "too expensive, we don't feel like paying for it, sucks to be you". (Wrapped in many pages of legalese, not those exact words.) > In the US system you have the luxury of choosing your providers and having your insurance cover things Well no, not really. If you mean chose between gold and platinum levels offered by employer, ok, but that's the extent of the choice. I'd like to choose an insurance company that gives me the medicines my doctor prescribes me. But no, I have no such choice available.

PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago

so many metrics for "good healthcare" and "bad healthcare", so a little expansion might be wise. * availability of a wide set of health procedures * median time to delivery of a given health procedure * outcomes from specific medical conditions * expected longevity, measured at various points at or after birth * cost of a given health procedure * median proximity to health care facilities * percentage of population without access to a given level of care * ... The USA does well on some metrics and badly on others. The one metric which is totally unambigous is the absurd cost we pay both in aggregate and for specific medical procedures, along with the lack of access to healthcare among the population.